George Zimmerman case...

[Lance 228]

http://youtu.be/PX1sxARNq_c

 

 

have you guys seen this?

 

Be interested to see what UVAO thinks...

[VHSLhelper 571]

yeah, been out for a while now.

If I lived in Fla, I'd prob. be mad about the state wasting my tax $$$ on this 3-4 week case. They can't PROVE anything against George since no one heard or saw (that we know of so far) who made initial contact. Best they can do is try and make the jury think Zim lied and/or had hatred or spite that night. AND convince 6 ladies of that. But they ask the cop if he remembered the color oif the bag handed to him (in the dark) ??? And it turns out Trayvon was the one using racial slurs? GOOD! LUCK!

And I found a new comedy show weeknights at 8 ... Nancy Grace. That gal is FUNNY!!!! Has no CLUE what is going on, yet talks constantly about Zim being guilty. Loved the Saran Wrap stuff last week.

[cwood78 161]

yep seen nancy, once she thinks you're guilty, she doesn't let up, even argues with "guests" she has on show......

[Deleted Account 5,203]

http://youtu.be/PX1sxARNq_c

 

 

have you guys seen this?

 

Be interested to see what UVAO thinks...

 

Long, long video. I managed to watch about 11:00 of it.

 

There were no witnesses to the key parts of these exchanges, and Zimmerman's story appears to be awfully consistent as time goes along. Watching that video, I could see a few moments where Zimmerman was clearly making up some inconsequential detail to keep the narrative going, which is a bad strategy to try at trial. But the key passages seemed earnest.

 

As to the facts, the timing of events is very important. One is allowed to use reasonable and proportionate force in defense of oneself. You can't bring a knife or a gun to a fistfight. If Zimmerman was acting aggressively toward Martin, then Martin has the benefit of the "stand your ground" law. HOWEVER, and what the liberal-loving media will NEVER report, if you flash a gun or even show the appearance of having a gun, you lose the claim of self-defense and you become the aggressor. That would mean that Zimmerman, not Martin, was properly using the "stand your ground" law. Martin didn't have a gun on him, but according to Zimmerman's testimony, Martin kept reaching toward his waistband. Common sense dictates that don't do that unless you (1) have a weapon or (2) want to scare the other person into thinking you have a weapon. It's a choice that cost Trayvon Martin his life.

 

Good luck getting THAT out of any media outlet that isn't FOX...

 

As to the jury, it's important. Very important. "This is probably as critical if not more critical than the evidence," Zimmerman's attorney, Mark O'Mara, told USA Today, regarding the makeup of the jury. And he's right. Six women: five white, one potentially Latina. And that one is HUGE. Black/Latino race relations in Florida are, shall we say, BAD. Very bad. If that Latina has the disposition of the majority in Florida, she'll inherently distrust Trayvon Martin. Latinas are also generally forthright and sincere in what they believe, and tend to be very convincing in their delivery. Important to note is that there are no black jurors, particularly since the black community almost is almost cultlike in "protecting their own" when their own has been a victim.

 

I say the above not to be racist, but as someone who recognizes cultural opinions within different cultures. Sure, that might border on stereotyping, but there's grains of truth, and those grains of truth often are the difference in a client spending the rest of his life in jail and being freed.

 

And I found a new comedy show weeknights at 8 ... Nancy Grace. That gal is FUNNY!!!! Has no CLUE what is going on, yet talks constantly about Zim being guilty. Loved the Saran Wrap stuff last week.

 

She was also the one who crucified those Duke lacrosse players, continuing even long after anyone in his/her right mind knew they were innocent.

It's a travesty that Paula Deen gets hammered for things she said 27 years ago, but Nancy Grace continues to have a career.

Edited July 2, 2013 by UVAObserver

[Lance 228]

Video is long, but you should watch it all...it's very important to hear what he has to say about how and why things evolved the way they did. I thought he came across as a very legit person. From what's been reported you would think he was on the phone with 911 the entire time and they were telling him to stop and not go after Martin...that's obviously not the case.

 

When you hear him describe it and add the context of the video showing where and how it all played out it makes a LOT more sense...and he was NOT on the phone with 911, it was the non emergency line....which to me is huge because he was just trying to get the cops out to check out what Martin was doing there in the beginning. He clearly was not in the frame of mind to hunt this kid down and kill him.

 

When things happen, things that are traumatic to your brain...full fight/flight mode in effect...you will often have reflections of your own actions later on and try to either make sense of what happened or reason with how you reacted in the way you did...I think that is a huge part of what is going on with Zimmerman in this video. He's walking through things less than 24 hours later with the police step by step and trying to explain things from 3 points of view here...his, matrins, and the people looking on watching it happen. That's where a lot of the making up of details comes in...he's trying to fill in the voids with what he "thinks" happened vs. how he reacted and trying to justify how he reacted all at once. It's an interesting process and very normal for anyone under such circumstances.

 

I think he's telling the truth and I think the testimony that the FBI "leaned" on the cops to file charges, after the officer stated in court that he didn't think charges should have been filed is going to be huge. The defense is doing a great job of dragging out all these little bits of info that paint a bigger picture when you put them all together...so far I just don't see him getting convicted. The prosecution is going to have to pull a rabbit out of the hat to win this.

[traveler4 10]

And if he doesn't get convicted the backlash is going to be ugly. I hope they will have police mobilized in Sanford when the verdict is read.

[Lance 228]

And if he doesn't get convicted the backlash is going to be ugly. I hope they will have police mobilized in Sanford when the verdict is read.

 

yeah because it doesn't matter what the facts are in the case, as long as certain ethnic groups get what they want.

[VHSLhelper 571]

I've never been on a jury, so I find it strange that the state can decide what lesser charges they want to file after the evidence is presented. Don't know what the 'requirements' are to find Zim guilty of manslaughter. And I hate to say this, but the state doesn't have to 'prove' whatever it is they 'need to prove'... they just have to convince the jury that they've proved it.

 

That said, I'm really disapointed at the backlash against the Miami girl last week. Everyone REALLY missed the point there... she did nothing to 'prove' Zim started it, even though she could've said whatever she wanted to concerning what she heard in the last few seconds of the call with TM. Her previous lies (like age & nickname) 'painted' her as unreliable, but since (IMHO) she didn't accuse Zim outright of starting it, I give her MAJOR props.

 

Also heard somewhere that manslaughter will be as bad as 2nd degree murder, since TM was a minor & a gun was used, so maybe the state is trying the ol' "let's see if we get the the jury to find him guilty of something we didn't 'want' to state with" route.

 

If only Trayvon HAD been videotaping that night. Oh well.

[Deleted Account 5,203]

I've never been on a jury, so I find it strange that the state can decide what lesser charges they want to file after the evidence is presented. Don't know what the 'requirements' are to find Zim guilty of manslaughter. And I hate to say this, but the state doesn't have to 'prove' whatever it is they 'need to prove'... they just have to convince the jury that they've proved it.

 

That said, I'm really disapointed at the backlash against the Miami girl last week. Everyone REALLY missed the point there... she did nothing to 'prove' Zim started it, even though she could've said whatever she wanted to concerning what she heard in the last few seconds of the call with TM. Her previous lies (like age & nickname) 'painted' her as unreliable, but since (IMHO) she didn't accuse Zim outright of starting it, I give her MAJOR props.

 

Also heard somewhere that manslaughter will be as bad as 2nd degree murder, since TM was a minor & a gun was used, so maybe the state is trying the ol' "let's see if we get the the jury to find him guilty of something we didn't 'want' to state with" route.

 

If only Trayvon HAD been videotaping that night. Oh well.

 

Yes, the State/Commonwealth can amend charges even after evidence is produced in jurisdictions that allow it. Some do, and Florida does. It happens very often of the day of trial, and it can happen well into a multi-day trial in those jurisdictions that allow it.

 

The difference in second-degree murder and manslaughter is the intent, or mental state, of the person carrying it out. The second degree murder in this case requires "malice aforethought" as one's mental state. Manslaughter just requires either "intentional" or "heat of passion" as the mental state.. It's a close line, but I'm not surprised to see the charge dropped to manslaughter.

[Lance 228]

I still think the state has screwed this one up, but the jury might go along with a lesser charge and see it as "an easy way out" to keep both sides happy or as middle ground....but, defense won't be happy with that one at all.

[ThomasDenton 79]

George Zimmerman found not guilty......I'm surprised that I'm the first one commenting on here about this.

[Deleted Account 5,203]

The correct verdict, based upon the facts and evidence presented to the jury. Of course, I predicted this when the jury composition was released. The facts categorically supported Zimmerman to a fault.

 

Of course, the cries of "racism" are rampant. Forget the facts and proper execution of legal process, it's gotta be "racism".

[ThomasDenton 79]

The correct verdict, based upon the facts and evidence presented to the jury. Of course, I predicted this when the jury composition was released. The facts categorically supported Zimmerman to a fault.

 

Of course, the cries of "racism" are rampant. Forget the facts and proper execution of legal process, it's gotta be "racism".

 

I saw a comment on Twitter that I kind of liked that went something like this: If you asked for justice and can accept the verdict (no matter what side you are on) then you got justice. If you asked for justice, but weren't happy with the verdict, then you really just wanted revenge.

 

I never really paid that much attention to the Zimmerman trial because I wasn't that interested. I mean, it was really tragic what happened and I think the legal system did it's job and it should be over now, but the case I'm more concerned with is Hernandez (a possible serial killer who's been making millions playing in the NFL). Seems like that should get some attention now.

[GMan 3,569]

Of course, the cries of "racism" are rampant. Forget the facts and proper execution of legal process, it's gotta be "racism".

 

The funny part about that is that Zimmerman is not "white", he's hispanic...

[BHS03 99]

The funny part about that is that Zimmerman is not "white", he's hispanic...

 

Or as the media says, a "white hispanic." I guess that makes Obama a White African American.

[Lance 228]

looks like now the DOJ is going to go after him.

 

Also, Obama released a statement today and took a nice "shot" at "gun violence"...which is all this was ever really about, no one who was pushing this really cares about the kid or the hispanic guy shot him....they wanted to make this the poster child case for a n argument against concealed carry....now the machine is in motion already to change the FL law...Sharpton and his entourage of asshats are already on the way there to start complaining.

 

If not for that, this would have been a blip on the radar and gone, never sent to trial.

[redtiger 1,740]

as far as racism is concerned, its just ignorant people making a circus out of a young man losing his life and honestly its shameful.

 

Obamas "gun violence" statement is ignorant too. Going by the courts decision, a man was attacked and defended himself. But that's still gun violence. How exactly is a man defending himself a bad thing?

 

and finally the end of my little rant, Stand Your Ground laws. Its a sad day when many Americans argue that a man should legally have to flee from a situation in which his rights are infringed and his life is threatened, instead of standing his ground and protecting himself.

Edited July 15, 2013 by redtiger

[1inStripes 932]

I would say, had it become a national story like this case was, Sharpton and company would not have been in support of Christopher Cervini, but instead backing Roderick Scott in what was a case similar to this.

[ThomasDenton 79]

Heard my first real Zimmerman trial argument between two guys at a gas station here in Atlanta. Weird thing is that they were both. With all the hoopla of race-based arguing and riots and the large black population here, I thought there'd be arguments all over the place, but it seems like no one really cares that much about it (though maybe it's because I'm spending most of my time in and around this rehab hospital, so everyone here has more personal things to worry about). Been hearing about riots and protests on sites like Twitter, but haven't really seen anything on the news.

[redtiger 1,740]

I would say, had it become a national story like this case was, Sharpton and company would not have been in support of Christopher Cervini, but instead backing Roderick Scott in what was a case similar to this.

 

very true, Sharpton and company obviously have an agenda. Their calls for fairness and justice are sickening

[ThomasDenton 79]

http://www.mpnnow.com/news/x967378480/Roderick-Scott-I-had-to-protect-myself

 

So I just saw this story brought up on Twitter and the ones talking about it were wondering why it didn't make national headlines like the Zimmerman trial. Well probably because it was a black man that killed a white 17 year old and was found not guilty. The media can't get as much attention off of that.

[Deleted Account 5,203]

http://criminaldefenseblog.blogspot.com/2013/07/the-embarrassment-of-george-zimmerman.html

 

This will be my final word on Zimmerman, because I cannot top this post.

[redtiger 1,740]

Both of those are great links.

 

UVAO, its nice to hear from someone who is knowledgeable about FL law, very well written article.

 

ThomasDenton, I saw that case too. Theres only one reason the media didn't make a circus out of that case too, a Black person wasn't killed.

 

take a look at this,

 

http://news.yahoo.com/blogs/news/spooner-darius-simmons-shooting-trial-170359879.html

 

its listed on Yahoo as "could this be the next Zimmerman case?" and that is just a rediculious notion. Other than a black person(in this case a 13 yo boy, not a 17 yo young man) was killed the cases have nothing in common.

 

Something the writer of UVAOs article pointed out is that much of America is ignorant of the law and, due to the way cases and issues are presented through the media are angry. Ignorant and angry is a very dangerous combination.

Edited July 17, 2013 by redtiger

[bucfan64 307]

Reminds me of the time all us folks rioted over the O.J. verdict, anyone remember how violent we got? Breaking windows, looting stores, burning cars and being interviewed by Geraldo. Man those were the days!

[Lance 228]

Reminds me of the time all us folks rioted over the O.J. verdict, anyone remember how violent we got? Breaking windows, looting stores, burning cars and being interviewed by Geraldo. Man those were the days!

 

that was just up in WV lol.