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TazCo Cuts Middle School Sports and more


Ryan4VT
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45 minutes ago, RichlandsAlum said:

Not trying to pick a fight or be a major smart a--, but this does seem to be a good time to interject an observation about public debt.

If the functionality of the proposed schools is maintained for as long as our great-great-grandchildren will be alive, why is it unreasonable to finance the construction of those facilities in such a manner that they will share in the cost of them?  Of course, from a literal standpoint that isn't likely to happen -- most traditional issues have a limit of 30 years for repayment.  In terms of scale, I don't know how far out of whack that $2 billion dollars is for a market of the size and nature of Charlotte-Mecklenburg.

Don't get me wrong.  I'm not a fan of debt (and I'm currently on track to make my own organization debt free by 2026).  But for major capital improvements, there are many facets to that discussion.  And if a community truly values public education, debt for schools is a concrete political example of "putting your money where your mouth is."

Reading between the lines, I assume that sixcat's brother lives in Mooresville.  I've been gone from that area for a while but based on my understanding of that community's demographics and economic trends, I don't think an additional debt load of $245 million is going to place a huge financial burden on Mooresville.

Maybe I should have been a bit more explanatory.  I'm not attempting to be argumentative either so, don't take it as such!

My brother lives in Cornelius, not Mooresville, which lies in Iredell County.  Cornelius is in Mecklenburg County and is a part of the CharMeck school district.  How does it make sense for the Town of Cornelius (population 28,500) to take on $245 million in debt immediately followed by the remainder of the CharMeck school district taking on an additional $2 billion for the same cause?  To further compound those issues in Cornelius, they had an agreement in place at the time to have the Town of Cornelius control of the new schools given they had agreed to fund them.  Which meant CharMeck wouldn't be permitted to rearrange school boundaries to send students from outside the Town of Cornelius to the new schools. 

CharMeck reneged on the agreement and immediately rearranged school boundaries before the new schools even opened.  Using Hough High School as an example, the Town of Cornelius had the school designed and built to house 1,800 students.  When CharMeck rearranged boundaries, kids from North Meck were rerouted to Hough where the current enrollment now stands at 2,572.  Hough High School opened in 2012 and is already well over 30% over designed capacity!

Now, Cornelius is preparing litigation to formulate its own independent school district.  Which, incidentally, will cost the school district more money to fight in court.

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4 minutes ago, sixcat said:

Maybe I should have been a bit more explanatory.  I'm not attempting to be argumentative either so, don't take it as such!

My brother lives in Cornelius, not Mooresville, which lies in Iredell County.  Cornelius is in Mecklenburg County and is a part of the CharMeck school district.  How does it make sense for the Town of Cornelius (population 28,500) to take on $245 million in debt immediately followed by the remainder of the CharMeck school district taking on an additional $2 billion for the same cause?  To further compound those issues in Cornelius, they had an agreement in place at the time to have the Town of Cornelius control of the new schools given they had agreed to fund them.  Which meant CharMeck wouldn't be permitted to rearrange school boundaries to send students from outside the Town of Cornelius to the new schools. 

CharMeck reneged on the agreement and immediately rearranged school boundaries before the new schools even opened.  Using Hough High School as an example, the Town of Cornelius had the school designed and built to house 1,800 students.  When CharMeck rearranged boundaries, kids from North Meck were rerouted to Hough where the current enrollment now stands at 2,572.  Hough High School opened in 2012 and is already well over 30% over designed capacity!

Now, Cornelius is preparing litigation to formulate its own independent school district.  Which, incidentally, will cost the school district more money to fight in court.

Seems like your 4th paragraph may answer your 2nd.  :)

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Just now, sixcat said:

Maybe I should have been a bit more explanatory.  I'm not attempting to be argumentative either so, don't take it as such!

My brother lives in Cornelius, not Mooresville, which lies in Iredell County.  Cornelius is in Mecklenburg County and is a part of the CharMeck school district.  How does it make sense for the Town of Cornelius (population 28,500) to take on $245 million in debt immediately followed by the remainder of the CharMeck school district taking on an additional $2 billion for the same cause?  To further compound those issues in Cornelius, they had an agreement in place at the time to have the Town of Cornelius control of the new schools given they had agreed to fund them.  Which meant CharMeck wouldn't be permitted to rearrange school boundaries to send students from outside the Town of Cornelius to the new schools. 

CharMeck reneged on the agreement and immediately rearranged school boundaries before the new schools even opened.  Using Hough High School as an example, the Town of Cornelius had the school designed and built to house 1,800 students.  When CharMeck rearranged boundaries, kids from North Meck were rerouted to Hough where the current enrollment now stands at 2,572.  Hough High School opened in 2012 and is already well over 30% over designed capacity!

Now, Cornelius is preparing litigation to formulate its own independent school district.  Which, incidentally, will cost the school district more money to fight in court.

I should also add, residents of Cornelius pay separate taxes to Mecklenburg County and the Town of Cornelius.  Cornelius used only Town tax revenue to fund the new schools.

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1 minute ago, sixcat said:

Maybe I should have been a bit more explanatory.  I'm not attempting to be argumentative either so, don't take it as such!

My brother lives in Cornelius, not Mooresville, which lies in Iredell County.  Cornelius is in Mecklenburg County and is a part of the CharMeck school district.  How does it make sense for the Town of Cornelius (population 28,500) to take on $245 million in debt immediately followed by the remainder of the CharMeck school district taking on an additional $2 billion for the same cause?  To further compound those issues in Cornelius, they had an agreement in place at the time to have the Town of Cornelius control of the new schools given they had agreed to fund them.  Which meant CharMeck wouldn't be permitted to rearrange school boundaries to send students from outside the Town of Cornelius to the new schools. 

CharMeck reneged on the agreement and immediately rearranged school boundaries before the new schools even opened.  Using Hough High School as an example, the Town of Cornelius had the school designed and built to house 1,800 students.  When CharMeck rearranged boundaries, kids from North Meck were rerouted to Hough where the current enrollment now stands at 2,572.  Hough High School opened in 2012 and is already well over 30% over designed capacity!

Now, Cornelius is preparing litigation to formulate its own independent school district.  Which, incidentally, will cost the school district more money to fight in court.

Oh wow....  I just assumed Mooresville because I know that they are building some new schools there and the population figure seemed about right.  I'm sure that the leadership of Cornelius had its reasons, and I have no basis for criticism, but I don't know why any locality within Mecklenburg would try to do something like that on a public school basis.  Then again, I know that particular community has a longstanding affinity for big ticket capital items.

I thought Davidson had stepped in it with regard to their decision to enter the cable business.  But that looks much worse.

Not that it matters, but Mooresville is on pretty solid footing and it's not far up the road -- unless your brother is seriously enamored with Cornelius, of course.

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13 minutes ago, UVAObserver said:

In the public sphere, “debt” is not an evil word in and of itself.  “Debt” when coupled with “where the Hell is this money coming from?!” is evil.  

That seems to be a good summary of the situation that Tazewell and other SW Virginia localities are facing.

Although I'm an expenditure wonk by nature, this would appear to be a revenue-driven issue.  Unless someone really brilliant can pull a rabbit out of a hat, only resolution I see is a combination of consolidation, increased taxes for residents, and debt.  

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Last night (Tuesday, June 19), the Mecklenburg County Commission approved a County budget totaling $1.7 billion, including increased support for the students, teachers, staff and schools of Charlotte-Mecklenburg Schools and pre-K programs in the county. CMS released the message below this morning. See original CMS budget request at ourkidsneedus.org.

 

Details (from the Charlotte Observer 6-20-18) include:

 

“The budget increases funding to Charlotte-Mecklenburg Schools by $31.1 million, including $11.8 million for raises for locally funded employees and $6.9 million from the current budget for increased local salary supplements for teachers and staff. CMS had requested nearly $40 million in extra funding. It also continues a recent emphasis on early childhood education, including $9 million for enough new pre-kindergarten classrooms to serve 600 children. "I think absolutely this is the right thing to do," CMS Superintendent Clayton Wilcox told WBTV, the Observer's news partner. "I think county commissioners are being brave in stepping forward."

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20 minutes ago, RichlandsAlum said:

Oh wow....  I just assumed Mooresville because I know that they are building some new schools there and the population figure seemed about right.  I'm sure that the leadership of Cornelius had its reasons, and I have no basis for criticism, but I don't know why any locality within Mecklenburg would try to do something like that on a public school basis.  Then again, I know that particular community has a longstanding affinity for big ticket capital items.

I thought Davidson had stepped in it with regard to their decision to enter the cable business.  But that looks much worse.

Not that it matters, but Mooresville is on pretty solid footing and it's not far up the road -- unless your brother is seriously enamored with Cornelius, of course.

Funny you should say that.  He is actually house shopping as we speak in the Mooresville area.  His job requires him to be within a certain radius so, parts of Mooresville are not an option.  He seems fed up with what's happened in recent years in Cornelius.  Especially given he essentially pays taxes twice.

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13 minutes ago, JGray said:

Last night (Tuesday, June 19), the Mecklenburg County Commission approved a County budget totaling $1.7 billion, including increased support for the students, teachers, staff and schools of Charlotte-Mecklenburg Schools and pre-K programs in the county. CMS released the message below this morning. See original CMS budget request at ourkidsneedus.org.

 

Details (from the Charlotte Observer 6-20-18) include:

 

“The budget increases funding to Charlotte-Mecklenburg Schools by $31.1 million, including $11.8 million for raises for locally funded employees and $6.9 million from the current budget for increased local salary supplements for teachers and staff. CMS had requested nearly $40 million in extra funding. It also continues a recent emphasis on early childhood education, including $9 million for enough new pre-kindergarten classrooms to serve 600 children. "I think absolutely this is the right thing to do," CMS Superintendent Clayton Wilcox told WBTV, the Observer's news partner. "I think county commissioners are being brave in stepping forward."

This is a budget rather than debt service but still offers good insight into what's already a difficult financial situation in CharMeck.  

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53 minutes ago, UVAObserver said:

I would be here all afternoon writing the reasons why, but imagine a modest increase in property tax.  Raising real property taxes in Tazewell County by $.01/$100 generates about $280K in revenue in the County.  Raising real property taxes in Mecklenburg County would almost certainly generate exponentially more.  There’s so much more “play” in figures there than here.

 

In the public sphere, “debt” is not an evil word in and of itself.  “Debt” when coupled with “where the Hell is this money coming from?!” is evil.  

I agree debt isn't necessarily a bad thing in-and-of-itself.  But the real estate tax rate in Tazewell County is $0.055 per $100 of assessed value.  It's $0.10707 in Mecklenburg County with a 3/4 cent increase coming in 2019. 

And they still can't afford to pay everything they owe!

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8 minutes ago, JGray said:

Last night (Tuesday, June 19), the Mecklenburg County Commission approved a County budget totaling $1.7 billion, including increased support for the students, teachers, staff and schools of Charlotte-Mecklenburg Schools and pre-K programs in the county. CMS released the message below this morning. See original CMS budget request at ourkidsneedus.org.

 

Details (from the Charlotte Observer 6-20-18) include:

 

“The budget increases funding to Charlotte-Mecklenburg Schools by $31.1 million, including $11.8 million for raises for locally funded employees and $6.9 million from the current budget for increased local salary supplements for teachers and staff. CMS had requested nearly $40 million in extra funding. It also continues a recent emphasis on early childhood education, including $9 million for enough new pre-kindergarten classrooms to serve 600 children. "I think absolutely this is the right thing to do," CMS Superintendent Clayton Wilcox told WBTV, the Observer's news partner. "I think county commissioners are being brave in stepping forward."

Fair enough; I figured the amounts would be reduced by about 30% or so, because Mecklenburg County isn’t on D.C.’s doorstep like Fairfax County is.  Still, that’s not overwhelmingly disproportionate as to scale and economy.

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Brian Woodson @bdtwoodson

The Tazewell County School Board has made the necessary adjustments to the budget to allow coaches to receive their stipends for the upcoming school year. In addition, middle school sports will play on. Good news for Tazewell County sports fans.
 
great state
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2 hours ago, Ryan4VT said:

Just got reported a few hours ago that they’ve got coaching supplements back and middle school sports back. There was SEVERE backlash from the public when word got out. Glad they made the right choice. 

Doubt they would’ve ever gotten rid of them anyway... seems like it was just a  way to distract the rest of the county that they were closing Raven and Springville 

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On 6/30/2018 at 9:37 AM, Bulldogs52 said:

It was the TCSB way of getting the extra money from the BOS.

 

On 6/29/2018 at 9:31 PM, EH31 said:

Doubt they would’ve ever gotten rid of them anyway... seems like it was just a  way to distract the rest of the county that they were closing Raven and Springville 

My sentiments also...

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First of all I am glad the Middle School sports were returned to the athletes. But it glosses over the elephant in the room that one talks about. Southwest Virginia's economy is dying and there is nothing that can be done to save it. I have posted about this many times, If you dram a line from Gate City to Abingdon, everything north of that line is going to face more and more crisis' like this. There are no jobs and hence the decline in revenue and student populations. There will come a day in the next twenty years that they will be one high school in each county, except for a few special circumstances. The Southwest Virginia counties can't keep up because they are losing tax revenue and students like the hole in the side of the Titanic. So enjoy what you can now, because the can is just getting kicked down the road and the day of reckoning is coming. Don't get me wrong my sports passion is SW Va. high school football and people can chose to be naïve or willfully ignorant about what is coming, but don't throw School Boards and County Governments under the bus for having to make those tough choices. I wish Tazewell County the best in trying to figure out their financial house, because they are going to need it.

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32 minutes ago, sixcat said:

That is an interesting article. It does seem as if we are in a perfect storm of disaster on this end of the state. 

As far as Tazewell county goes, I wonder where we rank across the state for personal property taxes. I think after this last increase we are .60 per $100 accessed. I may be incorrect on that. I'm sure I may be looking at this wrong but it seems raising the property taxes "this time" is somewhat of a short sighted answer to the problem. In Bluefield, Va we have two elementary schools that are probably 1.5 miles apart. Dudley being a k-2nd and Graham Intermediate 3rd-5th. Both Richlands/Cedar Bluff and Tazewell/North Tazewell are somewhat similar in distance between each other but they are all to my knowledge k-5. I dont see the benefits of the having the two schools in Bluefield Va set up the way they are. I'm afraid we have some more tough decisions to be made in the very near future.

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17 minutes ago, 99Bama said:

That is an interesting article. It does seem as if we are in a perfect storm of disaster on this end of the state. 

As far as Tazewell county goes, I wonder where we rank across the state for personal property taxes. I think after this last increase we are .60 per $100 accessed. I may be incorrect on that. I'm sure I may be looking at this wrong but it seems raising the property taxes "this time" is somewhat of a short sighted answer to the problem. In Bluefield, Va we have two elementary schools that are probably 1.5 miles apart. Dudley being a k-2nd and Graham Intermediate 3rd-5th. Both Richlands/Cedar Bluff and Tazewell/North Tazewell are somewhat similar in distance between each other but they are all to my knowledge k-5. I dont see the benefits of the having the two schools in Bluefield Va set up the way they are. I'm afraid we have some more tough decisions to be made in the very near future.

I won't go too much into detail but my company pays a higher amount in taxes for an office in Galax than it does for an office in Abingdon.  The out-of-whack tax strategy in Galax is the key factor in Lowe's closing it's Galax store and building a new one a few yards up the street in Carroll County!  Taxes are a double edged sward.  You can go overboard and price yourself out if your'e not careful, which Galax seems intent on doing.  

After reading that article, I never knew Virginia was the only state where independent city's were separate entities than the county where they are located.  It stands to reason, if so many of Virginia's independent city's are struggling to survive, why is this still a "thing"?

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24 minutes ago, 99Bama said:

That is an interesting article. It does seem as if we are in a perfect storm of disaster on this end of the state. 

As far as Tazewell county goes, I wonder where we rank across the state for personal property taxes. I think after this last increase we are .60 per $100 accessed. I may be incorrect on that. I'm sure I may be looking at this wrong but it seems raising the property taxes "this time" is somewhat of a short sighted answer to the problem. In Bluefield, Va we have two elementary schools that are probably 1.5 miles apart. Dudley being a k-2nd and Graham Intermediate 3rd-5th. Both Richlands/Cedar Bluff and Tazewell/North Tazewell are somewhat similar in distance between each other but they are all to my knowledge k-5. I dont see the benefits of the having the two schools in Bluefield Va set up the way they are. I'm afraid we have some more tough decisions to be made in the very near future.

Tazewell County still ranks near the lowest in county real estate taxes.  $.55/$100 was tied with Buchanan County for lowest in VA, and Tazewell County has $12M less in coal/gas severance than Buchanan County does.

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