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what is the latest on reclassification of teams?


HB Burke
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I wonder what the enrollments would look like for a 4A system? A 0-500, AA 500-1000, AAA 1000-1500, AAAA 1500+. Wow...I think I answered my own question! ;)

 

Don't think it would work out that smoothly....they'd need to have about the same # of schools in each classification.....and I think the numbers should be shifted around every few years to keep about the same # of schools in each classification...

 

I say 1st quartile is A...2nd quartile is AA....3rd quartile is AAA and 4th quartile is AAAA....

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Don't think it would work out that smoothly....they'd need to have about the same # of schools in each classification.....and I think the numbers should be shifted around every few years to keep about the same # of schools in each classification...

 

I say 1st quartile is A...2nd quartile is AA....3rd quartile is AAA and 4th quartile is AAAA....

 

What would be the enrollment breakdown on that setup (useing current numbers for the schools?

 

I think that they would go 5A myself

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What would be the enrollment breakdown on that setup (useing current numbers for the schools?

 

I think that they would go 5A myself

 

According to: http://www.vhsl.org/files/rr-Sept30-...al-numbers.pdf

 

AAAA System:

 

A: 0-618 (cutoff: Brunswick)

AA: 619-1118 (Bruton-William Byrd)

AAA: 1119-1702 (Warhill-Halifax County)

AAAA: 1702+ (Green Run on up)

 

AAAAA System:

 

A: 0-545 (cutoff: Graham...oddly enough)

AA: 546-879 (Amelia County-Liberty-Bedford)

AAA: 880-1312 (Abingdon [LOL]-Grafton)

AAAA: 1313-1836 (Skyline-Princess Anne/Matoaca)

AAAAA: 1836+ (Princess Anne/Matoaca on up)

 

I like the AAAAA look better, and not just because Graham would get a cycle in A.

Edited by UVAObserver
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4A isint a good setup imo because that creates too much difference between the largest and smallest schools in each Group. IMO it needs to be at least 5A if not 6A.

 

Im with hacker; keep the 3A system and the divisions just split them statewide instead of regionally.

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What's the point of even going to a 4A or 5A setup when we have divisional play in football as well as several other sports?

 

All a 4A and 5A system does is spread out schools, make districts smaller (generally) and increase travel. Equal fourths/fifths also hurts the smallest schools (i.e. Division 1) because they'll get grouped in with a lot of current Division 2 schools.

 

The current system is fine with a few tweaks IMO:

 

1) As a couple others have mentioned, do divisions at the state level as in Group A football. It's not that difficult to carve up each division into four "regions" for playoff purposes to cut down on travel, which would be needed for sports like basketball and baseball/softball.

 

2) Get rid of that asinine sub-state quarterfinal round in non-football sports that allows region runners up to advance and just let the region champions go on to the Final Four. I could see (to an extent) having it before divisional play spread to other sports, but now it just allows too many mediocre teams to make the quarterfinals. I know it'll probably never go away, though, because it generates too much money.

 

Ironically, another drawback (from the VHSL's standpoint) to the 4A/5A setup is it decreases the number of state tournaments/championship games and therefore the cash into the league's pockets.

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Thing that jumps out at me is the fewer the divisons the fewer the State Champions, the fewer the State Championship games the fewer the playoff games meaning a sizeable cut in revenues. This will be interesting to see playout.

 

IDK I think they go 5A or 6A but IF they go 4A I bet that they keep Divisions (which IMHO defeats the purpose)

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IDK I think they go 5A or 6A but IF they go 4A I bet that they keep Divisions (which IMHO defeats the purpose)
Are you saying a 4A system with two divisions in each? That would mean 8 state championships...wow. I could see that pulling in more revenue but winning a state championship wouldn't mean as much.
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Thing that jumps out at me is the fewer the divisons the fewer the State Champions, the fewer the State Championship games the fewer the playoff games meaning a sizeable cut in revenues. This will be interesting to see playout.

 

I think you're overestimating the "revenues" the games generate vs. the proposed revenue.

 

1. They aren't particularly well attended in the first place.

2. It costs quite a bit to rent out the venues.

 

And most importantly:

 

3. The $10 cost is to see BOTH championship games in a class. 5 games > 3 games.

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I think you're overestimating the "revenues" the games generate vs. the proposed revenue.

 

1. They aren't particularly well attended in the first place.

2. It costs quite a bit to rent out the venues.

 

And most importantly:

 

3. The $10 cost is to see BOTH championship games in a class. 5 games > 3 games.

 

I'm saying it would be less....

1. fewer games fewer attending.

2. fewer games fewer venues to rent but still less in revenue

3. It's not 5 games > 3 games it is 5 games < than 6. even though it cost $ 10 per for both games you're drawing from four different communities times 3 different sites or 12 communities verus 8 communties (4A) or 10(5A) the biggest part of fans at games only come to see their own team.

 

and then wouldn't it be the same as saying if instead of having 6 groups playoff now, you would only have 4 groups playing off then, thus elimating two groups of playoff games to get there

To me it looks like mutiples of one number or the other the larger number having larger returns.

 

Don't take me wrong a change needs to be made. Tweaking what we have now or 5A sounds best with special attention given to the smaller school divides, once the numbers get past 12-1300 the play one way depth is there if the coaches can get in on the field.

A team shouldn't have to play teams that their student body is 80% or more larger than theirs. Just for debate purposes since football season is gone. What about a no larger than 50%

0-400 ---- 401-600 ----- 601-900---- 901-1350 ---1351-1800---1800 and larger

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I think you're overestimating the "revenues" the games generate vs. the proposed revenue.

 

1. They aren't particularly well attended in the first place.

2. It costs quite a bit to rent out the venues.

 

And most importantly:

 

3. The $10 cost is to see BOTH championship games in a class. 5 games > 3 games.

 

only thing is, most people dont watch both games...the Clintwood side and the Galax side were both empty as soon as the game was over with...1+ hr later both sides were full with mostly new people.

 

If that place holds 7K people, and everyone bought a ticket I'd say they sold 13.5K tickets...couldn't have been more than 500 people that stayed over from the first game.

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I think you're overestimating the "revenues" the games generate vs. the proposed revenue.

 

1. They aren't particularly well attended in the first place.

2. It costs quite a bit to rent out the venues.

 

And most importantly:

 

3. The $10 cost is to see BOTH championship games in a class. 5 games > 3 games.

 

The VHSL gets the revenue from the state semifinals as well. 12 games > 10 games. I'm not certain about the league's cut (if any) for the Group A quarterfinals after the change in format.

 

As Lance and Thundercloud said, a pretty small percentage of fans stay for both games. I've been to ten state final doubleheaders at three different sites, staying for both all but once and can verify that maybe a few hundred stay for both. It's also possible a small number even leave and pay to reenter (I still don't know why Salem makes people do this whereas Liberty and JMU didn't, at least in the past).

 

At $10 per ticket, the Salem games probably took in around $130k. Given a hometown team (Brookville) was playing in one of the AA games, I would guess the attendance at Liberty was strong as well.

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  • 4 weeks later...

From today's Kingsport Times News:

 

 

J.I. Burton principal Tim Duncan has sent a realignment proposal to the VHSL’s Redistricting and Reclassification Committee and to administrators throughout Southwest Virginia.

 

The Norton plan proposes realigning the Lonesome Pine, Black Diamond, Clinch Mountain, Cumberland, Hogoheegee and Southwest Districts into four conferences.

 

One would be a 2A league comprised of Gate City, Lee High, Lebanon, Union, Central, John Battle, Virginia High and the future Dickenson County High School. Another conference would include Maron, Abingdon, George Wythe, Richlands, Tazewell, Carroll County and possibly Graham. A third would feature Twin Valley, Grundy, Hurley, Northwood, Twin Springs, Thomas Walker, Rye Cove as well as Haysi and Ervinton until consolidation.

 

J.I. Burton would like to belong to a conference that includes Eastside, Castlewood, Honaker and Clintwood (until consolidation), and also Rural Retreat, Holston, Patrick Henry and Chilhowie. At a glance, this configuration shows particular promise as a competitive 1A football league.

 

This appeals to Raiders football coach Jimbo Adams. He thinks travel distance issues with other sports could be managed c r e a t i v e l y.

 

“Some of those Region C schools need to come this way. There’s imbalance. Northwood plays Twin Valley already. And from Norton to Rural Retreat, we’ve made that trip before. It’s not a bad trip,†said Adams, who admits that the storied LPD’s days are numbered — one way or a n o t h e r.

 

“The bottom line is, we need more than three guaranteed football games each cycle. (The LPD) had an all-district meeting with two Division 1 and two Division 2 coaches. Fifty percent of our coaches were elected coach of the year. You can’t function reasonably in a league with only four teams.â€

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From today's Kingsport Times News:

 

 

J.I. Burton principal Tim Duncan has sent a realignment proposal to the VHSL’s Redistricting and Reclassification Committee and to administrators throughout Southwest Virginia.

 

The Norton plan proposes realigning the Lonesome Pine, Black Diamond, Clinch Mountain, Cumberland, Hogoheegee and Southwest Districts into four conferences.

 

One would be a 2A league comprised of Gate City, Lee High, Lebanon, Union, Central, John Battle, Virginia High and the future Dickenson County High School. Another conference would include Maron, Abingdon, George Wythe, Richlands, Tazewell, Carroll County and possibly Graham. A third would feature Twin Valley, Grundy, Hurley, Northwood, Twin Springs, Thomas Walker, Rye Cove as well as Haysi and Ervinton until consolidation.

 

J.I. Burton would like to belong to a conference that includes Eastside, Castlewood, Honaker and Clintwood (until consolidation), and also Rural Retreat, Holston, Patrick Henry and Chilhowie. At a glance, this configuration shows particular promise as a competitive 1A football league.

 

This appeals to Raiders football coach Jimbo Adams. He thinks travel distance issues with other sports could be managed c r e a t i v e l y.

 

“Some of those Region C schools need to come this way. There’s imbalance. Northwood plays Twin Valley already. And from Norton to Rural Retreat, we’ve made that trip before. It’s not a bad trip,†said Adams, who admits that the storied LPD’s days are numbered — one way or a n o t h e r.

 

“The bottom line is, we need more than three guaranteed football games each cycle. (The LPD) had an all-district meeting with two Division 1 and two Division 2 coaches. Fifty percent of our coaches were elected coach of the year. You can’t function reasonably in a league with only four teams.â€

 

Good idea. But boot out Carroll and include Graham.

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From today's Kingsport Times News:

 

 

J.I. Burton principal Tim Duncan has sent a realignment proposal to the VHSL’s Redistricting and Reclassification Committee and to administrators throughout Southwest Virginia.

 

The Norton plan proposes realigning the Lonesome Pine, Black Diamond, Clinch Mountain, Cumberland, Hogoheegee and Southwest Districts into four conferences.

 

One would be a 2A league comprised of Gate City, Lee High, Lebanon, Union, Central, John Battle, Virginia High and the future Dickenson County High School. Another conference would include Maron, Abingdon, George Wythe, Richlands, Tazewell, Carroll County and possibly Graham. A third would feature Twin Valley, Grundy, Hurley, Northwood, Twin Springs, Thomas Walker, Rye Cove as well as Haysi and Ervinton until consolidation.

 

J.I. Burton would like to belong to a conference that includes Eastside, Castlewood, Honaker and Clintwood (until consolidation), and also Rural Retreat, Holston, Patrick Henry and Chilhowie. At a glance, this configuration shows particular promise as a competitive 1A football league.

 

This appeals to Raiders football coach Jimbo Adams. He thinks travel distance issues with other sports could be managed c r e a t i v e l y.

 

“Some of those Region C schools need to come this way. There’s imbalance. Northwood plays Twin Valley already. And from Norton to Rural Retreat, we’ve made that trip before. It’s not a bad trip,†said Adams, who admits that the storied LPD’s days are numbered — one way or a n o t h e r.

 

“The bottom line is, we need more than three guaranteed football games each cycle. (The LPD) had an all-district meeting with two Division 1 and two Division 2 coaches. Fifty percent of our coaches were elected coach of the year. You can’t function reasonably in a league with only four teams.â€

 

Why would Abingdon and Carroll County be put with a small school like GW?

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Carroll County needs to be moved "that" way in any new district plan...no one on this side of Giles wants to play them and I'm sure they feel the same way...so...get rid of them already!

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Purely for grins, I threw together the following possible alignment....

 

BLACK DIAMOND: Council, Grundy, Haysi, Honaker, Hurley, Twin Valley

 

SOUTHWEST: Abingdon, John Battle, Lebanon, Marion, Richlands, Tazewell, Virginia High

 

CUMBERLAND: Castlewood, Ervinton, Rye Cove, Thomas Walker, Twin Springs

 

LONESOME PINE: Central, Gate City, Clintwood, J.I. Burton, Lee, Union

 

HOGOHEEGEE: Chilhowie, Patrick Henry (GS), Holston, Northwood, Rural Retreat

 

MOUNTAIN EMPIRE: Bland, Fort Chiswell, Galax, George Wythe, Graham, Grayson County, Rocky Gap

 

THREE RIVERS: Auburn, Eastern Montgomery, Floyd County, Giles, Glenvar, Narrows, Radford

 

RIVER RIDGE: Blacksburg, Carroll County, Cave Spring, Christiansburg, Hidden Valley, Lord Botetourt, Northside, Pulaski County, Salem, William Byrd

 

SEMINOLE: Amherst, Appomattox, Brookville, Jefferson Forest, Liberty (Bedford), Nelson County, Rustburg, Staunton River

 

DOGWOOD: Altavista, Chatham, Dan River, Gretna, Magna Vista, Martinsville, Patrick County, Tunstall, William Campbell

 

WESTERN VALLEY: Bassett, E.C. Glass, Franklin County, George Washington (Danville), Halifax County, Heritage, Patrick Henry (Roanoke), William Fleming

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Like the setup, RA, except for Graham's placement.

Logistically, it makes the most sense, yes. But not that much more than MED.

And rivalries. I'm a big fan.

 

I would personally prefer to have Graham in the SWD, but I think they'll become very comfortable with the relatively easy travel in the MED in a short amount of time.

 

There are also several contingencies in my markup that I didn't include. (Most notably the inclusion of Bassett in the "big schools" district. I could just as easily see them joining my Dogwood lineup intact or splitting that group into two districts.)

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