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Historical perspective -- how bad is this VT team?


RichlandsAlum
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I'm completely devout in my adherence to the Hokies, but I've always enjoyed some of the more colorful elements associated with the UVa rivalry from all angles.  I actually found the old "scramble" band and their halftime shows satirizing Tech to be pretty hilarious.  I also laughed at a sign one year that said, "The REAL score:  UVA 1300, Tech 800."  And although it's probably completely inappropriate, I chuckle every time I think about the fight between students/fans on the field at Lane Stadium after the 1984 game.

But I will readily admit that I have a pretty screwy sense of humor.

Here's hoping for an injury free -- yet spirited -- experience all around on Friday.

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7 hours ago, RichlandsAlum said:

 "The REAL score:  UVA 1300, Tech 800."  And although it's probably completely inappropriate, I chuckle every time I think about the fight between students/fans on the field at Lane Stadium after the 1984 game.

 

Video to this found on the web?

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There probably is no video evidence of the post-game shenanigans from 1984.  I don't think the game itself was televised.

But anyone who stuck around to witness it probably remembers.  In an effort to break things up (police presence was seriously overmatched) they turned on the sprinkler system and played "The Star Spangled Banner."  

Triggering effect was UVa fans making a bid to bring down the goal posts (just like Tech fans had done at Scott Stadium the year before).  They didn't get either one.  First attempt was at the south end zone, but that was blocked by quick reacting students/fans.  The Hoo faithful then turned their attention to the north end zone.  As a throng ran the length of the field, the first line of defense was the VT cheerleaders along with the Hokie Bird mascot.  As the UVa fans arrived on that end, the Hokie Bird (pretty much blindly, I would assume) just started throwing punches.  Quite a few of those connected and absolutely cold cocked some people.

Like I said, not a really proud moment for either side.  But still makes me laugh to think about it.

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18651

Left: 1971-1981 Long Neck Fighting Gobbler (donned by Lee Corso during Gameday's first visit to Blacksburg)

Middle: '82-'86 Short Neck Replacement and first Hokie Bird  (The brave 1984 field goal post defender)

Right: '87-present Redesigned Hokie Bird

Coach Bill Dooley disliked many things about VA Tech and implemented sweeping changes to rebrand the program through elimination of: the 7 1/2 foot mascot, team use of the VPI initials, the Fighting Gobblers name and logo, The old school TV helmet logo, Burnt Orange on Unis, and the lighted Gobbler and gobbling scoreboard. Dooley won at Tech but also got the school placed on probation during Beamer's early years.

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With regular season complete, I will rate this team as roughly comparable to 2012 team in terms of outcome -- assuming we draw a bowl assignment as "winnable" as the matchup with Rutgers in the Russell Athletic Bowl.  

Really perplexed by a lot of things today that go back to coaching.  But that might be a moot point.  I wouldn't be shocked if Fuente accepts an offer from Arkansas.

 

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I posted this on the main board but for some reason it was deleted:

 

what’s up with vt? Other than Mitchell they aren’t getting kids from SWVA. Stout left, didn’t get Allen, not offered Adkins, Forest was just offered by UVA. I just don’t understand?

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4 hours ago, Burrell’s Pearls said:

I posted this on the main board but for some reason it was deleted:

 

what’s up with vt? Other than Mitchell they aren’t getting kids from SWVA. Stout left, didn’t get Allen, not offered Adkins, Forest was just offered by UVA. I just don’t understand?

I hesitate to post this as a lifelong Hokie fan, but there was a definite bias against SWVA players during the Dooley years.  Even if they did make the team, uber talented guys like Eddie Hall from Graham rarely saw the playing field.  That changed under Beamer (maybe as a result of necessity in his first years -- playing under the effects of the probation terms that Dooley earned).  Maybe that's also perception due to Beamer's roots.

Fuente seems willing to go after talent wherever it is -- Mitchell is proof of that theory.  But there doesn't seem to be the same level of commitment by the current regime to SWVA that Beamer had shown.  (And more immediately I am really perplexed by the fact that they made little or no use of Mitchell yesterday.)

For the sake of argument I will offer a theory.  Virginia Tech will welcome students from Southwest Virginia in a broad and sweeping manner.  But only the truly extraordinary athletes will ever be considered within the revenue producing sports.

 

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On 11/29/2019 at 7:49 PM, RichlandsAlum said:

With regular season complete, I will rate this team as roughly comparable to 2012 team in terms of outcome -- assuming we draw a bowl assignment as "winnable" as the matchup with Rutgers in the Russell Athletic Bowl.  

Really perplexed by a lot of things today that go back to coaching.  But that might be a moot point.  I wouldn't be shocked if Fuente accepts an offer from Arkansas.

 

Hard to compare teams given how unique this one was.  I think this one is significantly more talented than 2012, though younger.  

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On 11/29/2019 at 7:49 PM, RichlandsAlum said:

I wouldn't be shocked if Fuente accepts an offer from Arkansas.

 

He would be dumb to do that. Why leave a team that has 21 returning starters (potentially -- if no one enters the portal) to go to a certified dumpster fire in Arkansas? Why go get the crap beat out of you by Bama and LSU and Auburn and TAMU every year?

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9 hours ago, Ryan4VT said:

He would be dumb to do that. Why leave a team that has 21 returning starters (potentially -- if no one enters the portal) to go to a certified dumpster fire in Arkansas? Why go get the crap beat out of you by Bama and LSU and Auburn and TAMU every year?

To the excellent points you raised, there is no guarantee about the number of players who will return based on the nature of the transfer portal.  (Our incumbent starting QB entered it himself just this past January.)  And the expectations of the Hokie fan base aren't necessarily reasonable, either.  A significant portion of Hokie supporters (including donors) were ready to chase Fuente out of town following the Duke game.  With all due respect, he would be a lot dumber to discount that factor when calculating his future plans.

In terms of competition within the SEC West, Alabama and LSU seem to be the only unreachable targets within the near term.  Jimbo Fisher appears to be a poor match for A&M and Auburn is often its own worst enemy.  Winning one of those four matchups on a regular basis (which is not unthinkable) might be enough to provide something akin to job security in Fayetteville.  

Ultimately it depends on Fuente's own personal career plans and ambitions.  

If the media reports can be believed -- incidentally, they can't -- then it appears that the Razorbacks are looking in another direction.  But I'm positive that there has been communication between Fuente and Arkansas within the last couple of weeks.

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15 hours ago, UVAObserver said:

Hard to compare teams given how unique this one was.  I think this one is significantly more talented than 2012, though younger.  

Agree with the point about talent and youth.  But statistically this team and the 2012 verson are extremely comparable.

2012 (per game averages):

    Passing Rushing Total Offense First Downs Penalties Turnovers
Split G Cmp Att Pct Yds TD Att Yds Avg TD Plays Yds Avg Pass Rush Pen Tot No. Yds Fum Int Tot
Offense 13 17.2 33.6 51.3 230.9 1.4 39.0 145.8 3.7 1.4 72.6 376.8 5.2 9.8 8.4 1.0 19.2 6.0 51.0 0.7 1.3 2.0
Defense 13 16.2 32.4 50.1 199.1 1.3 37.3 134.1 3.6 1.0 69.7 333.2 4.8 8.7 7.1 2.1 17.8 7.0 54.6 0.6 1.0 1.6
Difference   +1.0 +1.2 +1.2 +31.8 +0.1 +1.7 +11.7 +0.1 +0.4 +2.9 +43.6 +0.4 +1.1 +1.3 -1.1 +1.4 -1.0 -3.6 +0.1 +0.3 +0.4

2019 (per game averages):

 
    Passing Rushing Total Offense First Downs Penalties Turnovers
Split G Cmp Att Pct Yds TD Att Yds Avg TD Plays Yds Avg Pass Rush Pen Tot No. Yds Fum Int Tot
Offense 12 14.4 24.7 58.4 217.3 1.7 44.3 172.9 3.9 1.7 69.0 390.3 5.7 8.4 9.6 1.9 19.9 5.6 54.2 1.2 0.7 1.8
Defense 12 19.3 35.4 54.6 237.0 1.7 33.4 123.4 3.7 1.3 68.8 360.4 5.2 9.4 6.3 1.9 17.7 7.3 56.3 0.3 1.1 1.4
Difference   -4.9 -10.7 +3.8 -19.7 0.0 +10.9 +49.5 +0.2 +0.4 +0.2 +29.9 +0.5 -1.0 +3.3 0.0 +2.2 -1.7 -2.1 +0.9 -0.4 +0.4
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5 hours ago, RichlandsAlum said:

Agree with the point about talent and youth.  But statistically this team and the 2012 verson are extremely comparable.

2012 (per game averages):

    Passing Rushing Total Offense First Downs Penalties Turnovers
Split G Cmp Att Pct Yds TD Att Yds Avg TD Plays Yds Avg Pass Rush Pen Tot No. Yds Fum Int Tot
Offense 13 17.2 33.6 51.3 230.9 1.4 39.0 145.8 3.7 1.4 72.6 376.8 5.2 9.8 8.4 1.0 19.2 6.0 51.0 0.7 1.3 2.0
Defense 13 16.2 32.4 50.1 199.1 1.3 37.3 134.1 3.6 1.0 69.7 333.2 4.8 8.7 7.1 2.1 17.8 7.0 54.6 0.6 1.0 1.6
Difference   +1.0 +1.2 +1.2 +31.8 +0.1 +1.7 +11.7 +0.1 +0.4 +2.9 +43.6 +0.4 +1.1 +1.3 -1.1 +1.4 -1.0 -3.6 +0.1 +0.3 +0.4

2019 (per game averages):

 
    Passing Rushing Total Offense First Downs Penalties Turnovers
Split G Cmp Att Pct Yds TD Att Yds Avg TD Plays Yds Avg Pass Rush Pen Tot No. Yds Fum Int Tot
Offense 12 14.4 24.7 58.4 217.3 1.7 44.3 172.9 3.9 1.7 69.0 390.3 5.7 8.4 9.6 1.9 19.9 5.6 54.2 1.2 0.7 1.8
Defense 12 19.3 35.4 54.6 237.0 1.7 33.4 123.4 3.7 1.3 68.8 360.4 5.2 9.4 6.3 1.9 17.7 7.3 56.3 0.3 1.1 1.4
Difference   -4.9 -10.7 +3.8 -19.7 0.0 +10.9 +49.5 +0.2 +0.4 +0.2 +29.9 +0.5 -1.0 +3.3 0.0 +2.2 -1.7 -2.1 +0.9 -0.4 +0.4

The 2012 team did not have a stretch as poor as the Hokies' first 4 games, and did not have the rollicking last 8 games they had.  Statistically, you're right, but in terms of feel...

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