TTownTigers

No chance he's from Graham. I don't see a golden clock on his chest or a set of earplugs or headphones, so he can't be a sidelines visitor. Just sayin....

I think the GC folks, boosters, fans, and alums are a bit smarter than folks outside of Gate City give them credit for, including some on this board.

Classy bunch and speaks to the Coaching Staff/Turner. I'm rooting for the Bears to kick arse this coming weekend through the finals and will be rooting them on. If the Bears lose, I will cheer on the SWVA team that wins Region D, and that hasn't changed with me. If the Bears win a title, it would have been a good year in High School Football for me other than the Gate winning one, and of course, we were't anywhere on the planet to getting close, but I ALWAYS root for SWVA teams, regardless of rivals, former rivals, etc, and regardless of some smack talking between rival fans. To the Union fans out there, or more specific, the P. Valley faithful, I do respect the ole Vikings contrary to what you may believe.

I think it's Union by 10-14 points. Union 24, Marion 10 or 14ish. Union is solid up front, and the FBSer in Mitchell accounts for 10 pts, be it a kick off return, long rushing touchdown, or pick six, or a QB hurry up causing a fumble and pick 6, as of right now, it's 10-0 Union with Mitchell and playing at BSG before the game even starts. I don't think it's a blowout, but I think it's something resembling the Union vs Richlands first matchup in regular season in which Union doesn't blow them out by any means, but they control the game from start to finish and it's never in doubt. The major concern with Union in my opinion....and I know, some of you Union fans don't want to hear it because I'm a Gate City guy, but........Travis is a bit conservative offensively. His primary learning sources were legendary Turner style football at Appy and Beamer style offense at Tech. Back in the day, those worked by the way and both were awesome. But, I still think Turner needs to turn the dogs lose offensively. Open up the offense, it's 2017 and you have better talent than most. With that written, before some of you old P. Valley folks respond, I'm saying Turner is not just good, but among the top 3 coaches from Pearisburg, VA to the TN/Kentucky border in Virginia, but.......he has still an area where he can improve (like all coaches and people), and the area of concern with Union in my opinion is the downfield passing game. I'm not talking about the pass that comes when Union is up 14-0 from running the ball and everyone is in the box and Mitchell throws the ball to a WR that is wide open when 9 guys are in the box stopping the run. I'm talking about on 3rd and 7 when you have to throw and the defense knows it. That downfield passing game or lack of it is concerning. It was enough to keep Richlands in the football game a couple of days ago.

No matching wits here. Just giving you many factual statements. I know your thing, your mantra is the old "it's pure speculation" when you disagree with someone. I get it. PV could have been playing at the same level of Graham and Gate City. The numbers were similar, and they chose to play at that level and you absolutely know it's true. One last thing you need to never forget since you wrote in a previous post that "Gate City came up short against PV." You do understand who is who's bitc* in the all-time series, correct? Never forget that. Forget about classification (because you've been out-argued) and forget titles, fact is, over the years, when GC played PV, PV was the recipient of being GC's beeoootcchh much more times than we were yours. That stat will never change. In your mind, I'm sure you consider it "pure speculation." One other key fact, when GC dropped to Div 2, we played P. Valley 7 times in the playoffs before PV High closed/combined with Appy. GC was 5 and 2 against PV. What happened in the first decade of this century is exactly what would have been the case if we played at the same level in the 1980s. Your state titles came to a rapid halt. Imagine throwing in Graham in there and facing the rest of AA Virginia in the 80's You can slice PV's titles in half. You would have 4 at most, maybe only 3. The very thing that you and I are arguing actually happened in the 2000's. GC drops, and PV's state titles stops.

No jealousy here. I'm a GC fan. No need to be jealous of any team in Virginia other than Hampton. PV didn't win titles by speculation, they won them in A ball or Div 2 ball. That's a fact. And apparently, I know quite a bit more about historical VHSL teams than at least one of your buddies who can't even get his years straight for P.V. Central Lunenburg and the former legendary coach Chippie Chappell, I know all about em. They lost 10 games total (playoffs and regular season combined) from 1980 to 1989, and if you add in 1990, 11 total losses in 11 seasons and this includes the playoffs. Want to know a bit more, since I know nothing about historical VHSL football history? Chippie Chappell lived the first 10 years of his life not far from you and I. Bristol, VA. You are wrong on one point. You wrote when it came to classification and PV, it didn't mean diddley. Yes, it actually did. It's the reason you have an additional 3, likely 4 state titles that you simply wouldn't have won if you played AA ball before 86, or Div 3 ball after 86.

By the way, I agree the 1990 team with PV and Graham would have likely been close, but once again, you still seem to have that far SWVA vision or lack thereof regarding what lies beyond. It's the 2 beasts after Graham that would have caused PV trouble and would have beat PV, even if they somehow get by Graham in 1990 (which they wouldn't have). You see, playing a team like Graham in the region finals requires you to be emotionally way up and you likely get your depth chart cut into as you get an injury or two going into the next game at Rustburg, and if you win that, the same thing against Nottoway, and that's the part you don't see from PV's perspective. The road to winning a title was very tough and it really only just began when you got by SWVA. But to be fair, did you know who Central Lunenburgs long time rival is? It's Nottoway, and in 1990, in game 1 of the season, Lunenburg beat Nottoway 8-6 at Central-Lunenburg (Victoria, Va). But hey, I don't know "shit" as you say, lol, and I'm sure you aware of that fact, right? I'm sure you'll take it since it favors a PV argument, and it does for 1990 show that PV was certainly good enough to win a state title at the next level, but you can also see that there were 3 teams right there (Graham, Rustburg, Nottoway, and add Robert E Lee that year) that were equally as good as PV and when you have 3-4 teams as good, you have to be perfect down the stretch against competition that doesn't take a weak off compared to the road PV often travelled to get to the Single A or Div 2 state title game. 1990 is said to be one of PV's best of all time, but I think 98 was. 1998 would have won the state title from Div 1 through Div 4, and yes, it would have beat Salem who won it that year I think in Div 4 (big double A).

LOL, now you are using the word "maybe" yet you were quick to stay "your full of shi*" to me", and you can't even get the year right. In the same breath, you write how I know nothing. LOL. The your "full of you know what" comment is a good one that may better serve yourself. By the way, that 1989 PV team you refer to lost to GC in overtime that year in regular season. I assume (will give you the benefit of the doubt) that you meant 1990, and no, in 1990, you would not have beat Graham that year either, but again, you wouldn't have had to worry about it if you did, because you lose the next one. You see, PV at their level often only had to "get up" 2 of 4 games in the playoffs. At the next level in AA before 1986 or Div 3 after 1986, games 2 through 4 in the playoffs were atrocious, and even game 1 in the playoffs was losable. Example, in 1990, Powell Valley leads Gate City 26-18 with 10 minutes left in the game, and adds two late scores to pull away. No question, it was a solid PV team. That same Gate City team was down 34-7 at the end of the 3rd quarter against Graham in the region finals prior to a great Graham team (undefeated on the season) and some Graham fans have told me 90 was as good as 89. Gate City added a score with 54 seconds left in the game with JV players in to make it look more respectable, but it wasn't. It was an absolute blowout. My nephew was on that GC team. Graham absolutely pummeled Gate City in the region finals only to lose the next game at Rustburg. You see, for example in 1990, if PV were playing Div 3 at that time, they get Gate City again in round 1 of the playoffs, then at Graham in round 2 (Graham played teams like Salem back then and yes, they would have had more power points) then if you win, on the road at Rustburg, and if you win that, against Nottoway. Rustburg won the state title 7-6 over Nottoway that year. That Nottoway team turned the ball over 5 times to zero turnovers for Rustburg in the state title game and doubled them in yardage. Credit Rustburg for the win, but you get the point. The level of competition would have hindered PV from winning some of those titles. Certainly not all, but some, and I'm 100% confident 1982, 1985, and 1989 would have been state title goose eggs. Some of those early to mid 80's Courtland teams were some of the best AA teams to suit up in Virginia. This is what I'm talking about with PV than many in Big Stone again fell to realize.. Now you can call the above "BS" and scream and shout, but much of the above ae not about "me not knowing shi*". Much of the above are literally true statements-facts that occurred.

Not about PV beating GC or GC beating PV. It's about the following schools, Gate City, Graham, Radford, Giles, Blacksburg at one point, Martinsville, Jefferson Forest, Rustburg, Park-View Sterling, Courtland, Tabb, Southampton, James Monroe. It's about THEM schools, and I repeat, if you are AA in 1982 or 1985, you can forget it. Martinsville and Blacksburg would have crushed you, and if you somehow win, you get Courtland which was 28 points better. In 1989, you ain't getting out of the Region as Graham would have blasted you in 1989, and Graham and Rustburg would have done the same in 1990. You keep focusing on SWVA and "if we can beat GC, then we must have been able to go ahead and win the title." Like I wrote, take GC off the list and look at the other schools above. These teams aren't Madison County and Central-Lunenberg. I agree with you, numbers don't lie, and back then, single A ball (prior to 1985ish) or Div 2 (big- single A ball 1986ish) was exactly that, and there was a big difference in quality of teams between that level and the next level up.

Powell Valley was a great, great program, and I never wrote that Phil would have left the majority of those titles on the table. I wrote the word some, as in about 1/3rd. In 97, that Gate City team was lights out by seasons end, but we were beat all over the field by Jefferson Forest. Many talk about the multiple OT game with Graham in Bluefield in 97 of which I couldn't go and was a classic, but I watched Jefferson Forest and we were fortunate, fortunate, and fortunate some more. This was a classic. They were a BETTER team than we were in my opinion. If we play 10 times, they win 8 of 10. No discredit to the Gate, we got the W with the famous knuckler over the goal post, and on to win the title the next game, but Jefferson Forest would have beat Powell Valley in the playoffs. We can debate it forever yes or no. There's no point, but my point is, forget about just Gate City and Graham. Many fell to realize you had to go through a Giles and Radford at one point in the same region, but again, forget about all 4 of these schools, it's what lies ahead in that former Region C which was a beast with teams like J. Forest, Rustburg, Martinsville, Liberty, etc, and if you win that one, you don't get to play Central of Lunenburg or Madison County, you get to play a Nottoway, Southampton, Tabb (yes, Tabb was AA and in Gate City and Graham's level before the 6 Divisions were introduced in the mid 80's). This is the point that P. Valley fans fell to mention, and it's not even on purpose, they simply weren't aware of the caliber of some of these teams Outside of the old Region 4. Many constantly go to the "Jones Brothers". These teams were fantastic. I'm referring more to the 80's, for example, Powell Valley's first title in 82. They would have been beat by 28 points against Tabb, or Courtland, or Martinsville that year. It would have been no contest. In 1985, P. Valley's second title. Both Giles and Blacksburg would have wiped the field with Powell Valley, and again, so would have Tabb and so would have Courtland. In 89, Graham would have crushed Powell Valley, they wouldn't have had to worry about advancing outside of the Region that year. Those 3 state titles for Powell Valley would have been null and void and simply wouldn't have been titles. In the 90's, I don't argue regarding the Jones Brothers, but I still believe one of those teams would have been beat on one of those years against a team like Jefferson Forest or Rustburg in Region C. I think that's definitely true for Powell Valley's last state title.

True, add to that, if P. Valley played in Div 3 where the belonged with Gate City and Graham and Giles and Radford in the same region, he also wouldn't have had all of those titles. Those would be trimmed by a bunch, not to mention, the competition that awaited in the old Region 3 in the state semi final game with teams like Rustburg, Jefferson Forest, etc.

I don't know, maybe due to patterns. The patterns are, Mitchell is absolutely one heck of a Hoops player. He's college material. More of the same, expect Tazewell to have a losing season year in and year out. Like I say, patterns man....patterns. The poster wrote the word "ball" and when you are great at basketball like GC, it can come off that way. Mitchell is a great Hoops player, not just a great football player.

I said Appo is 21 pts better than anyone else in AA this year. Should I retract that statement? Check this out......and I know, it's tough to go by common opponents and score matching to assess a team, but as fans, it's still fun to do. Check this out... Appo vs Dan River. Appo wins 34-21 at Dan River. Last night, Glenvar 38-0 over Dan River at Glenvar. I think Dan River is a rival game for Appo, but still, those 2 scores are a huge, huge difference in common opponents, and favoring Glenvar. Appo vs Fork Union. Appo wins 49-36 at Appomattox. Fort Union vs 2A, Region A 1 seed Goochland who finished 9-1, Goochland won 32-0. Again, common opponent, but dramatic difference in score favoring Goochland. Maybe Appo can be beat. I hope so.

Agree. Giles is by far the best team Appo will have played since the Heritage loss. I hope Giles beats em up. Appo seems to rise to the occasion though. If this game is at Giles, I think it's going down to the wire and a toss up. At Appo, I just don't see the Spartans pulling it out, but I hope they do.

Good, glad you know. Also, glad you remember in case your "we" comment doesn't represent every poster or every basketball fan in SWVA of which you intended it to. Glad that "we" know.

No, Giles does not have a chance. No, Appomattox is not 30 point favorites than everyone in AA this year like they were last year, but they are still 21 point favorites, and 21 points is a lot of points. One poster wrote 10 point favorites. That's wishful. We want it to be 10 points better than everyone else because we know that makes it doable. Fact is, it's not 10 points better, it's more like 21 points, and like 2016, "it's not doable." Appomattox 35-Giles 17. Appomattox will get out to a lead (because they are winners) and Giles will try to play from behind. Whether it's Giles turning over in its own territory early or Appo getting 2 huge break away or busted plays, look for Appomattox to go up by 2 TD's early, and it's game over.

I'm not so sure Richlands is better up front than Marion. As a matter of fact, I think Marion is the best team up front that Union has played until this point. The dude at Marion may also be the best coach in SWVA AA ball. I'm not saying he's the absolute best, but he's up there among the best. Marion is a very well coached football team.

If by ball, you mean football, he's incredible. If by ball, you mean basketball, he's very good, but he's no Mac.

Likely to be next year. They take a major step back in talent from the last 3 years.

Got a big offensive line and if you can run the ball, you are in games. They seem to have that.

Great topic and I can speak to it because I played against Carlock's Graham's teams and had many relatives play against them in those 90's years. I think it goes to show how hard it is to win a state title. I also think that Richlands talent is not terribly different for the current times (last 15 years) compared to Graham's talent of years ago when compared to it's neighbors in current Region D, or the old Region 4. I think it's insane that Mance has taken Richlands so far so many times and that speaks to coaching and a well ran machine. Same with Carlock. It also speaks to.......my point a few months ago about Powell Valley. No offense, but again, I'm sorry, some of those state titles just ain't happening if Powell Valley is playing (Div 3) in the mid 80's to late 90's like Graham and Gate City did. Many PV faithful would ask and have asked which Graham or Gate City team would have taken them down on their state title years, but they fell to understand it's not just about Graham or Gate City or Radford (powerhouse back then), it's also about the beast that would await you in (Region 3) back then such as a Rustburg, Martinsville in the 70's to early 80's, a Jefferson Forest, and if you win, you get to tangle with a Tabb, Southampton, or James Monroe which were absolutely nasty back then. I recall a few years you speak of. 1982 was a P. Valley state title in which they were solid, but they ain't beating Tabb that year in a state title if they were AA like Graham and Gate City. No chance, no way. The 89 Graham team would have whipped P. Valley as well, and the Radford of 1989 would have also beat Powell Valley. The 1990 Graham team would have beat Powell Valley and I watched the 1990 team beat GC in the playoffs in the region, and went on to lose at Rustburg to a team they may have should have won against. Graham dominated the game, but somehow lost, and had a QB that didn't seem to be able to throw it much, and they ran it all game long. Both Graham and Rustburg would have beat P. Valley that year. That's 3 right there. I never saw the Graham of 95 team play that won it, but the PV of 1995 could have played with them for sure that year more than likely. They were fantastic. As for Graham of 2001, this is a team that probably should have won a state title and one could fault Coach Carlock for that one. It's rare. He's like Frye. Their ain't many mistakes and much to fault, but the team I watched in 2001 was far more athletic and talented than the Turner Ashby, Broadway, Harrisonburg (can't remember which team it was) that beat em. Especially with a kid named Bradshaw that didn't get many touches, but you could tell back then I think when he was a sophomore, he was going to be special. Overall, it's hard to win a title and Mance is a great coach. So was Carlock. So was Phil Robbins at Powell Valley and Fry. Many fault Coach HF for the losses in the 70's to Martinsville and Southampton, but again, those teams were very talented in which he lost and it just goes to show how tough it is to win a state title. I still don't think Richlands has a gigantic talent gap compared to other schools in the area. It may have widened some in the last 5 years since Richlands has been winning, but they've been winning for to long now to simply have a decade and one half of "gold" talent. This means, much of it is and has to be solid coaching. It's the same with Graham's Carlock that you mentioned. I watched Graham come to Lebanon one time in the 80's against a Lebanon team that had a wickedly fast running back named Eric Buchanon who was a very good player, but also a track star. I set beside his father and he told me, "Graham always seems to have tons of talent." It was the same back then as it is with Richlands today in that....much of that is coaching, and a good coach can make the talent look awesome, and when he wins, he then has talent that wants to play for him.

I would love to see Chilhowie or Narrows bring home a title, but 1A may be worse than 2A regarding 1 team and separation. Riverheads is likely 35 points better than the next closest 1A team this year, at least by 28 points. They are more likely to win it (even more) compared to Appomattox. If a team like Chilhowie were to run into Riverheads, the clock-keeper needs to get ready in the early 3rd qtr. It would be that bad, but it's not just Chilhowie. Follow their scores, as it doesn't matter if it's one of the fast teams from the coast like Essex or Sussex in the semi's or a team back this way in the finals, it's not going to be close.

I agree, but it's not just this year with Richlands in the playoffs, it's going back over a decade in which they may have very well been the better team in many or at least some of those state-semi and state-final losses which came at the same thing, bailing out on the run, especially on 2nd and 5 or 6 or 3rd and 4 or 5 and killing drives, and they had the same thing many times in these losses (near misses that had a guy open for a TD) only to be dropped or tipped or whatever, but the thing is, if you don't complete it, your drive is over, and High School Football has short quarters. They go by quick and you only get so many possessions. But with Mance, I don't think it's a playoff thing. He does in regular season as well, but they still win 9 or sometimes 10 of 10 on many years because the scheme fools people, but there are almost always games you play late in the year in which you have to run the football effectively to win, or at least run after you open it up with the pass, but Richlands doesn't do that, they keep throwing even when the game seems like its been opened up with the pass like against Appo 2 years ago, and they got caught.

I agree with your premise, but I still think Mance "gets by" in regular season with the finesse passing game. He is a solid coach and there is no doubt about it, but he wins many games in the regular season by scheme and passing schemes which separate his team from a team that may be close in talent and gets the W. The problem is, when they get in the playoffs and play an equally talented team, you simply can't out finesse your way to a championship, you have to run the ball, or at least more be balanced. He went away from the run 3 seconds into the second quarter of this game regarding running the ball on 3rd and 5's, and many 2nd and 5's, and in the second half, it was huge. It left enough clock for Mitchell to make a play. But, credit Union also. Richlands other than the big pass and the 2nd series of the game couldn't move the ball much either. The game was a toss up and could have gone either way. Why Richlands chooses so many times to bail out on the run on a 3rd and 5 with an incompletion, when they could likely have a 4th and 1 and go for it and try to get the yard baffles me. They've done it for years, and they get by most of the time and win the game, but either deep in the playoffs against an equally talented team, or early this year in the playoffs against Union, that lack of run focus catches them so many times. It's tough on a heavy-pass laden offensive line to practice pass blocking most of the time, then try to make the switch to run blocking, especially at the High School level.

I think he is as well with the one exception at Dinwiddie (Class 4A). K'vaughan Pope is a 6'2, 210 LB commtted to Ohio State and one of the top players in the country who is the 4th ranked LB in America and a top 100 player. Mitchell is ranked higher than Basham, Beck and Graves of Appomattox.