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[ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] Coming into this season only three teams had won 10+ games each of the last three seasons...USC, Texas, and VT. VT has already won 10 games this season extending their streak to four consecutive years. USC must win against either UCLA or their bowl opponent to win 10 games this season and Texas must win their bowl game to continue their streak. [/ QUOTE ] Does that mean we get to put something in that trophy case at Merryman? A nerf ball in place of the crystal, perhaps. [/ QUOTE ] Virginia Tech could always use that unofficial bass-fishing championship. a "Funky Boogie Bass" would be a humorous thing to see.

[ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] http://www.sportingnews.com/yourturn/viewtopic.php?t=309537 WHO'S PRIVILEDGED NOW? Virginia Tech linebacker redshirted as a freshman, the last time the Hokies lost to Virginia, and finished 4-0 against them in his career. He said it felt especially good to finish off the sweep in a big game. "I remember coming out of high school when (Virginia coach Al) Groh was telling me I should be priviledged to go to UVa, and I was like, "Are you serious?"' he said. "Things like that make you like, "You know what? I'm going to go to Virginia Tech so when we meet up, we're going to beat y'all and I don't want to hear nothing."' [/ QUOTE ] *head smack* Actually, that kind of thing reflects poorly on both Virginia Tech and the individual player. "I don't want to hear nothing." That's just brilliant. [/ QUOTE ] Bingo.

[ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] That is indeed true. My error. However, wouldn't it be a small logical leap to say that if he was practicing there, and had the intention to go there, and all that was lacking was that he was not formally admitted, that he had the prerequisites to get into Virginia? [/ QUOTE ] If he had been planning to attend UVA as a National Merit Scholar, that would be a reasonable conclusion. The fact that his admission status had not been resolved when it became an important issue indicates that he was given consideration that the majority of UVA applicants do not receive. This fact also serves as further evidence to refute your point. Rebuttal, counselor-in-training? [/ QUOTE ] You equate giving preferrential consideration with compromising the academic standards of the University of Virginia, and those two do not necessarily go hand-in-hand. I am not in favor of preferrential treatment of athletes, don't get me wrong. However, he wasn't doing educational work over the summer in a frantic attempt to bend the academic standards get in. His academics were set by the time he left high school, and for Virginia to consider him, he must have had the academic criteria to make it in.

Just one more year, through 2011. Let's not get hasty now! I am not in favor with this sort of rollover extension. With a $1.7 million salary, Groh should be expected to have seasons of this caliber or better every year. Let's hope that he retires when his wide ride ends in 2011. He will not take Virginia to the next level.

I must say, that is quite impressive. It takes a high caliber of team to achieve such a level, especially in today's college football. I tip my cap to the Hokies.

That is indeed true. My error. However, wouldn't it be a small logical leap to say that if he was practicing there, and had the intention to go there, and all that was lacking was that he was not formally admitted, that he had the prerequisites to get into Virginia?

Ahmad Bradshaw met the requirements; he wouldn't have been admitted to Virginia otherwise. As did Herman Moore. What happens when each recruit gets here is quite another story.

Haha! All in fun, my good friend. I enjoy the quibbling...wouldn't be in law school otherwise!

I've enjoyed this season quite a bit, myself. Here's to parity!

Of course, I'm not disputing that. I honestly believe the best team in the Big East is better than the best team in the ACC. However, the depth of the conference, in my opinion, in worse. As I have said multiple times, the ACC and Big East are battling for last among the major conferences.

Yes, Virginia was down to Connecticut, the second-best team in the Big East, with two minutes to go. The Cavaliers also won. The third-best team in the ACC beat the second-best team in the Big East. I definitely do agree with your analysis on Groh. He deserves the ACC coach-of-the-year given the work he has done.

Exactly! Virginia Tech isn't in the Big East anymore! If you use that argument, you're living on the history of the conference, rather than its present, which is the whole crux of debate. Just like those Big 10 supporters than continue to live with Woody Hayes and Bo Schembeckler

A very farcicial statement. Any time a team beats a team that is 9-3 and ranked sixteenth in the nation, it is a quality win. No reason for that lack of disrespect toward Virginia.

Again, no basis to prove that the Big East is better than the ACC. Thus, unprovable given your facts.

[ QUOTE ] Here's a reminder for you Fishy... Even if Richlands wins back-to-back State Championships, they have to live the rest of their lives knowing Graham put an end to their regular season winning streak and the mighty Blow'Naders did not beat the two Bluefields the year of their second title. That's GOT to hurt... As for you crybaby UVA fans...you guys are unbelievable!!! You have excuses for everything. You scream "THUG" when a VT player makes a clean tackle, yet you say it was the VT QB's fault he got hit late. Your recruiting class for the last several years under Groh has been rated higher than VT's by all the recruiting services yet play the "academics" card when VT hands you your ass on the field. And in turn, you say Groh does pretty well with what he has to work with...which acccording to the recruiting services is a pretty good group of kids...yet, UVA continues to underachieve under the direction of The Chessmaster. Do you realize the greatest D-lineman to ever wear a UVA uniform went 0-4 vs. VT during his career? Enjoy the Music City Bowl... www.dontfirealgroh.com [/ QUOTE ] Do you just enjoy flaming without any basis for your accusations? Recall one post for me where I called Chris Ellis a "thug". You can't, obviously, because it doesn't exist. Likewise, name one point where I said Sean Glennon "deserved" the hit. Alas, it doesn't exist! You know better than to make two baseless accusations like that, my friend. There's no reason to flame. With regards to the Ellis hit on Sewell, the hit itself was a horse-collar tackle. That is illegal in professional football, but perfectly legal in college. That's fine, I understand that. However, what I have referred to without rest is the extracurriculars after the play. Upon conclusion of the play, Ellis CLEARLY AND WANTONLY jerked Sewell's facemask upward after the play. He then proceeds to make a display while Sewell is lying on the ground, partially due to the facemask-jerk. In any football league, this is a 15-yard personal foul penalty. To my knowledge, only one of Groh's recruiting classes was ranked higher than Beamer's: the vaunted (and disappointing) 2002 class. That class was ranked 11th nationally. No other Virginia recruiting class has surpassed the ranking of a Virginia Tech class. If you have facts to support yourself, please present them. You generally do when you really, truly want to prove a point. I think you'll be surprised if you look at the recruiting ranks. As I have stated, with LITTLE retort from you, academics have been an issue in Virginia recruiting. Refute some of my facts. Provide me evidence as to where I'm wrong. You've failed to do so thus far. Also, I can even quibble with your analysis that Chris Long is the best to wear a Virginia uniform. Chris Long is indeed one of the best to wear a Virginia uniform, I'll give you that. He likely wil be the highest defensive pick ever drafted from Virginia. However, it is not a mortal lock that Long is the best. The current sack leader in Virginia history is Chris Slade, with 15 in a season. Chris Long has 13.5. You are also incorrect in your inflammatory bowl projection. I'm sure you are aware that the ACC allows teams within one loss of another to jump them. To get the Music City Bowl, both Clemson and Wake Forest would have to jump Virginia in the bowl selection process. Wake Forest has a worse overall record, worse conference record, and has lost to Virginia. This will not happen. I am convinced that Clemson will jump Virginia for the Gator Bowl, since Clemson travels quite well, and since the Gator Bowl has passed over Virginia in the past under similar circumstances. I certainly not a "crybaby", or any other similar third-grade insult you will likely come up with. Far from it. I give credit where credit is due; recently in other posts, I've taken up for Virginia Tech. However, I'm will not stand for someone bashing my alma mater and its supporters without anything resembling a reasonable purpose. I'm too hot-blooded for that.

Absolutely senseless violence. Almost unfathomable. My prayers go out to his family (especially his wife and his one-year old daughter who will have zero recollection of her daddy). My prayers also go out to the two organizations he played for: the University of Miami and the Washington Redskins.

Seen it many times. Especially after the Wyoming game! I think it's flat out funny, and that hits the spot, often enough. Especially when I get in an anti-Groh mood. Thankfully, I haven't been in one of those in about three days .

Oy vey! Both Virginia Tech and West Virginia have played "good" teams in a "good" schedule. Virginia Tech had six wins against teams with .500 or better records: East Carolina, Ohio, Clemson, Georgia Tech, Florida State, and Virginia. Clemson and Virginia are currently ranked. Georgia Tech and Florida State have been ranked during the course of the season. To bring an impressive statistic: Virginia Tech has the 12th-hardest schedule in the nation, with the overall opponents' record standing at 68-48. Not to mention that the Hokies' only two losses have indeed come against second-ranked teams. Now, I will stop supporting a Virginia Tech football argument before I throw up. West Virginia hasn't had a cupcake schedule, either. The Mountaineers have also beaten six teams at .500 or better: Maryland, East Carolina, Mississippi State, Rutgers, Cincinnati, and Connecticut. Cincinnati is currently ranked, while Rutgers and Connecticut have been ranked at some point. Likewise, West Virginia's strength of schedule is not nearly as high as Virginia Tech's. In the end, Virginia Tech has played a slightly more quality schedule. The Mountaineers have one loss to a good team, while Virginia Tech has two losses to excellent teams.

[ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] I won't lie. I am jealous. I'm jealous that they get to be in a conference that's weak enough to allow them to win week in and week out. I'm jealous that they didn't have to play LSU. I'm jealous that they don't have to play a conference championship. I'm jealous that when the day is done, despite all these "X" factors, they get to say that they competed in a national championship, win or lose. [/ QUOTE ] Alright. I am freakin tired of all this bullshit. You all lost two games, we lost one. We are #2, you are #6. Yall let a 10-0 lead turn into a loss in the last 3 minutes of a game. You play in the ACC. They have been horrible this year. We destroyed our opponent in our "conference title game". You barely beat a Virginia team that was beat by Montana. The fact that a team that was beat by Montana shows us all how strong the ACC is this year. Yall have proven nothing to me. You have a defense...and a very, very mediocre offense. Yall can stop the crap talking and stop whining. The excuses to why you are not in the national hunt are all piss poor excuses. Shut the hell up and have fun trying to stop Matt Ryan again. [/ QUOTE ] First and foremost, the transitive property is bunk when it comes to football! Just because Virginia lost to Wyoming and Virginia Tech only beat Virginia by 12 does not mean than Virginia Tech is mediocre. Virginia lost to Wyoming in Week 1. Montana is a I-AA school, albeit a historically strong one; they lost to James Madison in the national title game a little while back, but I digress. The Cavaliers are a MUCH different team than in Week 1. Ask the nine teams that fell to them. As much as I hate to say it, Virginia Tech more than "barely" beat Virginia. The Hokies outgained the Hoos' offense by over 200 yards. As far as it goes, Virginia beat the second-ranked team in the Big East; it is not a stretch to believe that Boston College, Clemson, Wake Forest, Florida State, and Virginia Tech couldn't do the same. West Virginia is a highly-talented team, there's no question about that. In my opinion, Virginia, Clemson, and Boston College would be competitive with West Virginia. Virginia Tech would give them everything they could handle, and would stand a 35% chance of beating them, in my opinion. Why are we even talking about this, anyway? This is the marketplace forum. Let's move this to the proper forum, or better yet, drop it altogether.

Haha, no problem, bud.

I apolgize for writing a one-thousand-word treatise. It is laid out as clearly as possible. However, the misinformation in the previous post definitely warranted it.

[ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] I am with you UVA Observer: As much as it pains me to say that Tech indeed has the better team. The programs are definitely miles apart and will likely continue for the next few years at least. UVA will always be mediocre in football and fans need to accept that fact! Hopefully one year we will finally beat the Hokies and it will be sweet but for the time being we have to move on and worry about our program and getting better each and every year. A lot of the difference comes from the whole recruiting process and the fact that UVA has voluntarily raised their entrance requirements means that they can only recruit probably 30 to 40% of the players other Div. 1 schools target. This leads to mediocrity but Groh has done a good job with what he has to work with...sometimes there are flashes of brillance, but for the most part its the same ole story year end and year out. Saturday's game boiled down to two plays: the interception at the end of the first half and the third and one call at the end of the 3rd quarter. Those two were momentum swingers and ultimately lead to UVA putting more and more pressure on the defense. Oh well, better luck next time. Hopefully Tech puts a whooping on BC and the Gator Bowl picks Virginia. [/ QUOTE ] Your second paragraph is the biggest crock of horses#it I've ever read on this board. UVA's problem is their coach...period. Until they get rid of him, expect no better than what they did this year. He does less with more than any coach in the country... [/ QUOTE ] You appear at times to know what you speak of, but this is definitely not one of those times. If you do not honestly believe that Virginia's more stringent recruiting does not harm football recruitment, you either just pay no attention to Virginia football or are sadly misguided in your views. I offer you three factors: 1. Virginia's acceptance rate is a highly respectable 37%. That is quite high; only William and Mary has a more stringent acceptance rate, at 16% (and it is private). Other schools do not have as stringent an acceptance rate: Virginia Tech's acceptance rate is a bloated 68%. This is not a lie: http://collegesearch.collegeboard.com/search/compare_schools.jsp? 2. A minor issue involves Virginia's lack of January enrollment. Suppose a highly-touted recruit chooses Virginia, but due to circumstances beyond his control, he is unable to come to school in August. Under the Virginia system, he must come anyway (and lose a year of eligibility via redshirt, in the process), or forfeit his scholarship and go to one of the many schools offering January admission. This has hurt Virginia in the past 3. This is the big one. If I'm not mistaken, Virginia requires each of its athletes to maintain a 2.5 GPA and have at least a 1000 on the SATs (1500 on the newer version) coming out of high school. There are many, many four-star and five-star players that simply do not meet this requirement. Virginia has to exclude them automatically, and often, Virginia Tech or a school of similar repute accepts them. In the end, most often Virginia Tech is better than Virginia in football. However, I'm more than proud that my alma mater does not sacrifice its rigid standards to bend the rules for the sake of athletics. If not selling ourselves out for profit is the price I have to pay as a fan, so be it. You are only slightly correct in your synopsis of Al Groh. I have said multiple times that I do not believe that he is the coach to take Virginia to the next level, and I still firmly believe that. He loses in-state recruits (the ones that meet academic standards, that is) time and again to Frank Beamer, which is unacceptible; it shouldn't be that hard to sell Charlottesville, which has held a ranking of America's best city, over Blacksburg. That's his fault. Likewise, he's never had much of a mind for offense, and hiring his son with no coordinator experience was not a wise move; Virginia has not truly excelled on offense since Ted Musgrave left. I also do not agree entirely with the "bend-but-don't-break" philosophy; this tends to wear out defenses over the course of the game, and it does in fact lead to big plays when the defense tires. I would like to see another head coach come in (preferably after Groh's tenure, if he keeps reeling off nine-win seasons) and inject his style into Virginia football. I hope that happens. Likewise, you are incorrect in your statement that Groh does "less with more" than anyone in football. That, my friend, has been accomplished by Karl Dorrell at UCLA. His career record currently stands at 35-25 over his five seasons to date. He has taken a team that had a highly realistic shot of a Rose Bowl birth to a 6-5 record (not counting this week's impending loss and highlighted by that 44-6 shellacking by Utah). With the talent in Southern California going to the Bruins, that is highly unacceptible. That is the textbook example of how to do more with less. Also, that's the reason my Los Angeles sources tell me that it's not a matter of if Karl Dorrell is fired, it is how quickly after the bowl game (if chosen)he's fired. You appear to have some sort of aggravated disrespect or hatred of Virginia football. That's perfectly fine by me. It doesn't take a genius to see that football is not Virginia's best sport; that's why every Virginia win in football over Virginia Tech is ten times sweeter than each loss. Virginia does extremely well in other programs by maintaining a high academic standard: check out this page to see exactly just how well Virginia has done against Virginia Tech: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Virginia-Virginia_Tech_rivalry The Cavaliers have 19 NCAA championships in school history; I can go to University Hall anytime and look at the trophies. In fact, 19 championships is much better than many other schools. For example, Virginia Tech has, uh-oh...

[ QUOTE ] Are we forgetting the guys in Lexington, KY. I believe they have more wins and a few more national championships than any of the schools on Tobacco Rd. (Also more probations. It is what it is.) [/ QUOTE ] True, Kentucky has the most wins of any major college basketball program. If we want to go the route of titles, look no further than UCLA, with 11 NCAA titles, with most during that legendary run by Wooden. Almost unfathomable to do today.

[ QUOTE ] Remember that bet about the Rose bowl can I take it back now [/ QUOTE ] Haha, of course! I'd also like to take back my predictions on last weekend's games. 0-4, I was.

And you'd get your much-anticipated West Virginia-Virginia Tech rematch! Of course, given the Hokies avenge the choke job. I'd like to see West Virginia win this weekend, though.