this is exactly what I was talking about, "u.s. gun culture to blame"

[buzzsawBeaver 12]

not the mentally disturbed people, never mind the ignorant fact that the law abiding citizens and students were "already disarmed" on their campus, it's going to be a witch hunt for guns and it's going to be the law abiding american citizen such as myself who's going to be expected to pay for this.

 

 

Every world leader who speaks in this article suggests the u.s. has to do something about their "easy" gun laws.

 

 

LONDON - The deadly university rampage in Virginia that killed 33 people sent shock waves around the world Tuesday with newspapers and talk shows delving into the American psyche and raising questions about lax gun controls in the United States.

 

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The gun control debate echoed across Europe, which has some of the toughest gun laws in the world.

 

Prime Minister Tony Blair offered his condolences to the victims' families.

 

"I would like to express on behalf of Britain and the British people our profound sadness at what has happened and to send the American people and most especially, of course, the families of the victims, our sympathy and our prayers," Blair said.

 

Two professors from India and Israel were among the dead at the Virginia Tech shooting, the deadliest in U.S. history.

 

Liviu Librescu, 75, an engineering science and mathematics lecturer tried to stop the gunman from entering his classroom by blocking the door before he was fatally shot, his son said Tuesday from Tel Aviv, Israel.

 

"My father blocked the doorway with his body and asked the students to flee," Joe Librescu said in a telephone interview of his father, who immigrated to Israel from Romania, and then moved to Virginia for his sabbatical.

 

A 51-year-old Indian-born lecturer in the engineering department was also among the dead, the man's brother told Indian media.

 

Most expressed shock at the shooting but few said they were surprised  criticizing the availability of guns in the U.S., lax gun controls and the number of Americans who cling to the constitutional right that allows them to bear arms.

 

"The Queen was shocked and saddened to hear of the news of the shooting in Virginia," Buckingham Palace said. Queen Elizabeth and her husband, Prince Philip, are scheduled to visit Virginia May 3-4.

 

British Home Office Minister, Tony McNulty, earned a masters degree in political science at Virginia Tech in 1982.

 

"I think if this does prompt a serious and reflective debate on gun issues and gun law in the states then some good may come from this woeful tragedy," McNulty said.

 

Many families expressed relief when they heard their children were safe. Some were still waiting for news.

 

"He sounded OK. I think they had been very shocked all day  struggling to get in touch with their friends," Charles Barnwell of Birmingham, England, whose son George, 20, was locked in his dormitory with eight friends during the shooting.

 

Australian Prime Minister John Howard said the shooting underscored the problems of a U.S. "gun culture."

 

Howard staked his political leadership on pushing through tough laws on gun ownership in Australia after a lone gunman went on one of the world's deadliest killing sprees 11 years ago in his country.

 

"We took action to limit the availability of guns and we showed a national resolve that the gun culture that is such a negative in the United States would never become a negative in our country," he said.

 

The Times of London ran an editorial delving into the American psyche and the weak gun laws across the country.

 

"Why, we ask, do Americans continue to tolerate gun laws and a culture that seems to condemn thousands of innocents to death every year, when presumably, tougher restrictions, such as those in force in European countries, could at least reduce the number?"

 

Gun crime is extremely rare in Britain, and handguns are completely illegal. The ban is so strictly enforced that Britain's Olympic pistol shooting team is barred from practicing in its own country.

 

Britain's 46 homicides involving firearms was the lowest total since the late 1980s. New York City, with 8 million people compared to 53 million in England and Wales, recorded at least 579 homicides last year.

 

"What exactly triggered the massacre in Virginia is unclear but the fundamental reason is often the perpetrator's psychological problems in combination with access to weapons," Swedish daily Goteborgs-Posten commented.

 

The shooting drew intense coverage by media in China, in part because the school has a relatively large Chinese student body and because U.S. reports said the gunman may have been Chinese or Asian.

 

Private citizens are forbidden from owning guns in China.

 

"Why are there were so many shooting incidents in American schools and universities?" said a comment posted on the popular Internet portal Sohu.com. "People should think why an American-educated student would take revenge against America?"

 

Yuan Peng, an American studies expert, was quoted by state-run China Daily as saying the shooting illustrated America's problems with gun control and a lack of security at American universities.

 

"This incident reflects the problem of gun control in America," said Yuan, from the China Institute of Contemporary International Relations, a Beijing-based think tank.

 

Only 7 percent of the more than 26,000 students at Virginia Tech are foreign, according to the school web site. But Chinese undergraduate and graduate students comprise nearly a third of that. There are about 600 or so students and teachers and their family members from China at the school, said Xue, the Chinese student union president.

 

In Italy, leading daily Corriere della Sera's ran an opinion piece entitled "Guns at the Supermarket"  a critical view of the U.S. gun lobby and the ease with which guns can be purchased.

 

"The latest attack on a U.S. campus will shake up America, maybe it will provoke more vigorous reactions than in the past, but it won't change the culture of a country that has the notion of self-defense imprinted on its DNA and which considers the right of having guns inalienable," Corriere wrote in its front-page story.

 

In Italy, there are three types of licenses for gun ownership: for personal safety, target practice and skeet shooting, and hunting. Authorization is granted by the police. To obtain a gun for personal safety, the owner must be an adult and have a "valid" reason.

 

Several Italian graduate students at Virginia Tech recounted how they barricaded themselves inside a geology department building not far from the scene of the shooting.

 

___

 

Associated Press Writers Charles Hutzler, Alexandru Alexe, Raphael Satter, Robert Barr, Karl Ritter, Nicole Winfield and Gavin Rabinowitz contributed to this report.

[beano5 14]

one of my teachers said it perfectly today...gun control laws will NOT stop a psycho who is bent on killing someone...they WILL find a way to kill whether it be stabbing choking or some other method...i hate to say it i really do..but gun control laws wont help murders...they will help mass murders like this...but not petty murders...

[old_school_blue 247]

the only people that liberal gun laws will leave unarmed is honest people. How many drug dealers or gang bangers have you seen buy a gun at Wal-mart or a sporting goods store?

[buzzsawBeaver 12]

reprinted from months ago for the ronoake times april 17th edition

 

"Unarmed and vulnerable

 

Bradford B. Wiles

 

Wiles, of New Castle, is a graduate student at Virginia Tech.

 

 

On Aug. 21 at about 9:20 a.m., my graduate-level class was evacuated from the Squires Student Center. We were interrupted in class and not informed of anything other than the following words: "You need to get out of the building."

 

Upon exiting the classroom, we were met at the doors leading outside by two armor-clad policemen with fully automatic weapons, plus their side arms. Once outside, there were several more officers with either fully automatic rifles and pump shotguns, and policemen running down the street, pistols drawn.

 

It was at this time that I realized that I had no viable means of protecting myself.

 

Please realize that I am licensed to carry a concealed handgun in the commonwealth of Virginia, and do so on a regular basis. However, because I am a Virginia Tech student, I am prohibited from carrying at school because of Virginia Tech's student policy, which makes possession of a handgun an expellable offense, but not a prosecutable crime.

 

I had entrusted my safety, and the safety of others to the police. In light of this, there are a few things I wish to point out.

 

First, I never want to have my safety fully in the hands of anyone else, including the police.

 

Second, I considered bringing my gun with me to campus, but did not due to the obvious risk of losing my graduate career, which is ridiculous because had I been shot and killed, there would have been no graduate career for me anyway.

 

Third, and most important, I am trained and able to carry a concealed handgun almost anywhere in Virginia and other states that have reciprocity with Virginia, but cannot carry where I spend more time than anywhere else because, somehow, I become a threat to others when I cross from the town of Blacksburg onto Virginia Tech's campus.

 

Of all of the emotions and thoughts that were running through my head that morning, the most overwhelming one was of helplessness.

 

That feeling of helplessness has been difficult to reconcile because I knew I would have been safer with a proper means to defend myself.

 

I would also like to point out that when I mentioned to a professor that I would feel safer with my gun, this is what she said to me, "I would feel safer if you had your gun."

 

The policy that forbids students who are legally licensed to carry in Virginia needs to be changed.

 

I am qualified and capable of carrying a concealed handgun and urge you to work with me to allow my most basic right of self-defense, and eliminate my entrusting my safety and the safety of my classmates to the government.

 

This incident makes it clear that it is time that Virginia Tech and the commonwealth of Virginia let me take responsibility for my safety."

[dawgs05 10]

[ QUOTE ]

one of my teachers said it perfectly today...gun control laws will NOT stop a psycho who is bent on killing someone...they WILL find a way to kill whether it be stabbing choking or some other method...i hate to say it i really do..but gun control laws wont help murders...they will help mass murders like this...but not petty murders...

 

[/ QUOTE ]

 

Exactly! Tougher gun control laws will not prevent someone like this guy from shooting a place up.......if tougher gun laws would prevent it then wouldnt you think that with all the laws and punishments against murder it would have stopped murders all together??

[guesswho 10]

guns dont kill people !!people kill people

[tom 10]

When i worked at the USPS for those 8 yrs, i had a sticker in my locker that said it too well....'guns dont kill people, postal workers do'..some found it amusing some didnt...lol

[buzzsawBeaver 12]

good comments yall, More good reads on the facts.

this is from the uk, where they have banned guns and have few around, even among the police, and as with australia, another gun free country after their ban, they can all tell you how much worse it's made the crime in their respective countries.

.

 

"As for arming the citizens, John Lott, a Yale scholar who studies firearms and the law, has done several studies that show US states that have "right to" or "shall carry" laws in regards to handguns, have consistently lower crime rates, including firearms offenses, than states with the most draconian gun laws, such as New York, Massachusetts and the District of Columbia. Virginia is a right to carry state, and had liberal academics not sabotaged the senate bill allowing guns for protection on campus, the death toll in this tragedy would have been far, far less. Gun rights in American are more about personal liberty than simply "packing heat" and the media does a great job of making firearms owners out to be cretinous loons who sit around in the dark in their underwear stroking their AR-15 with glee. Nope, it is as much about controlling one's destiny and person as abortion rights, or any other contentious personal liberty that comes at the expense of the state. This ability to control one's destiny is what lies at the heart of the 2nd Ammendment and makes the case for the right to bear arms as an individual right, not a collective right as some revisionist scholars would have it. Read John Lott's works and you will see that an armed society is a polite society. To put it in perspective, at least I won't go to jail in the States for protecting property; in Britain it's a crap shoot on how a magistrate interprets "reasonable force" - what nonsense! Who is he or she to judge one's actions at 3 AM when facing some hyped-up yob in your entry way! If a few of these thugs were dropped in their tracks they might think twice about breaking and entering... You need only look a the rocketing rate of property crime post-Dunblane and in Australia post-gun amnesty. It became a free for all once risk was removed from the equation."

[buzzsawBeaver 12]

"I know it sounds simplistic to say that when you take guns away from ordinary citizens, you only leave them in the hands of criminals - but it does seem to be that case. 64,000 legitimate GB, great britain, handgun owners handed in their guns (for paltry compensation) and the subsequent period has seen a massive upsurge in firearms (mostly handgun) crime.

 

Every fresh piece of restrictive firearms legislation in UK history has been followed by an increase in crime and deaths due to unlawful firearms use/ownership."

[BigD4VT 11]

Question, Have you ever used or been a position to use a handgun to protect yourself or others? I'm talking about as a private citizen on your own time. Not while in the military. I was just thinking about that and I've never known anyone who has. I have a cousin who was in the marines and is a former uniformed White House secret service agent. He always carries his gun and can have it drawn and against your forehead in fractions of a second... but he's never had to use it on his own time. I've known lots of other people who own handguns for protection but like I said, none of them have ever so much as shown it in a real situation.

 

I have however known people who had their guns stolen from their residence (while not home) or car. Guns that undoubtedly ended up being used by real criminals in real crimes.

 

I've also known and/or known of people who accidentally shot themselves or someone else, including children, with a gun they bought for protection.

 

I myself was robbed and carjacked at gunpoint by someone using a gun they stole from an unoccupied residence. I've read other evidence to support the claim that most guns bought for protection end up being stolen and used in a crime.

 

The guy who killed 32 people at Virginia Tech was apparently very smart (testing the system with bomb threats). The knowledge that some of his targets may be armed would not have stopped him. A gun free society would not have stopped him either. It may have changed his tactics but if he was intent on killing as many people as he could he would've found another way.

[Bulldogs52 484]

Thats right big D. Gun laws or no gun laws people still going to do this stupid sh**!!! Well if they take the guns away from us all its going to be like drugs, there be some fool out there that got some across seas some how and selling them like drugs, that why this world today totally screwed because people just dont give a damn any more!!!

[tom 10]

Look, ill guarantee you if this shooter had known or thought possibly soemone was armed in that hall, he would've chosen another target, guarantee it. As for using my gun in self defense OUT of the military, YES, i have only had to draw my weapon on 2 different occasions, thankfully that was enough but the 2nd incident was one wrong move from turning deadly.

 

FIRST, I was a college student and deliverin newspapers at 5am on Rt 52 near Pinnacle Rock and that lil rundown club that sits back in the wide spot in the curve at top of hill, well im sittin in my truck getting the bill and paper together and there was still several drunks in the p-lot, one strolls over to my truck while i had my head down and jerks the door open, I had my 92F stuck between the seat and i drew it instantly and as he stuck his head and body in the cab of my truck that pistol was literally 1 inch from his nose. Even drunk he was smart enuff to understand and he immediately looked crosseyed at the business end of the gun and raised his hands, backed out and closed my door..no harm done, i pulled off and drove away.

 

SECOND 1997 Im living in Charleston and my wife and i go to see a 9 pm movie at Park Place Cinemas downtown,(the scene of numerous attacks on both men and women over the years) we have to park in the multi level parking garage, we park get out and we are immediately approached by 3 black males wanting to 'borrow' some money, i put my wife behind me as i spoke to the main young man and as we spoke the other 2 are being all non chalant and meandering around and when they fnally got to the end of my peripheal vision at that time i drew my 228 from my hip, pulled the hammer back and just held it as my side and continued to speak ever so politely to them. When they all 3 noticed that i was not going to be a victim and i was armed, they quickly appologized and thanked me for my time and beat feet quicker then they showed up. Now, thankfully i didnt have to shoot anyone but the 2nd incident was the closest b/c those clowns were trying to distract me and work their way around me. Had i not been armed, i could not have fought off 3 20 yr old men even tho i would've tried and who knows what could've happened to my wife. Point is this, id rather have it and not need it, than need it and not have it, afterall who says they werent armed i just got the jump on em and they knew they wre outgunned! It all goes back to what both i and the police have often said, the police cannot protect you 100% of the time so you have to take some responsibility for your own safety.....period

[BLU 10]

2nd Amendment purposes right there!. Not to encourace "kids" on here to have one, but know there needed and not to be used cowardly.

[tom 10]

important thing is buy your gun when legally allowed, take training courses, practice, practice, practice...know the weapon inside and out and ***UNDERSTAND THIS*** just b/c soemone may want to fight, doesnt mean you can draw a gun, you MUST percieve your life or soemone elses life or health to be in imminent danger. carrying a gun is a huge liability, even if i fire shot legally and hit an innocent, im screwed. To carry a gun everyday, you have the obligation to step in if someone elses life is in danger and you can potentially stop it but the biggest thing is MINDSET, you have to be willing in your mind to take another life, if you cant bring yourself to pull the trigger, you do not need a gun. Mindset is most important of all, you draw a gun on soemone thats armed or NOT armed and cant pull the trigger, they will either shoot you with their gun or take YOURS and shoot you with it...fact, so dont take the 2nd Ammendment lightly

[tom 10]

just seen on news and it seems people are starting to finally get the concept to arm and protect themselves..finally!

[bucfan64 309]

This is just another opportunity for the ANTI-GUN lobby to preach about disarming America. I hate to say it but when this happened the powers that be at CNN, NBC, ABC etc new that they had an opportunity to spread more of their insidious garbage.

 

Britain has a right to talk.....since basically making it impossible to own a gun in the U.K. the VIOLENT CRIME rate has increased nearly 200%. The same has happened in Australia, Sweden and a few other countries. As someone said before, when you outlaw guns only OUTLAWS will have guns.

 

Don't punish me for something that some sick, perverted psycho did. I wonder what would have happened if only ONE of those kids or professors were ALLOWED to have a right to carry permit?

 

By the way has anyone heard ROSIE spewing out her propoganda?