Observer77

[ QUOTE ] Whoever said G Men 35-0 is an idiot and knows nothing about football.I hate how some Graham fans on this board think their team is so far superior to all other teams in this area. VHS is 3-0. Sure they havent beat anyone that great but they are still 3-0 and are much better than last year, and last years team came close to beating Graham. I dont think VHS will beat Graham but they will not get shutout 35-0. I just dont see Graham being able to shutdown HB Tyrone Mitchell. [/ QUOTE ] Others have already added their $.02, but I can't pass this up after this reply. Who is the idiot now? By the way, LegendAtLegion is from Gate City, not Graham & was giving his unbiased take on the game. You, however, in "jmarcum fashion" come on here with the screen name VHSFan999 & we are to think you are being unbiased? Has V-High ever beat Graham is the best question I can think of...

Honaker 40 Castlewood 6 Gate City 27 Applachia 12 Grundy 48 Paintsville(KY) 12 Richlands 34 Abingdon 14 Must truly be a sad situation to hope another team (out of district nonetheless) defeats a rival distict foe when you couldn't do it yourself...sour grapes abound!

I personally don't think it will be a close game at all, Grundy will run all over the Tigers of Paintsville. True, they are 4-0 but have faced very weak competition up to this point. The four teams they have faced are a combined 3-12, with one of those victories coming from two of those teams facing each other (Raceland 1-3, Allen Central 2-2, Jenkins 0-3, Fleming Neon 0-4). Paintsville is a very small school, less than 250 students in grades 9-12. They'll play tough but it won't be enough to hang with the Wave. Grundy has too much for them, trust me. Even their own fans are calling for their demise & admit their opponents so far haven't been what you call "quality opponents" (link below): http://www.bluegrasspreps.com/showthread.php?t=46207 On another note: Jenkins, Fleming-Neon and Whitesburg (I think) will be no more after this year. Consolidation will take place and form Letcher Co. Central. With these three schools combining, their enrollment should be a little over 1000. That possibly could be a good opponent for scheduling in the future for some Virginia teams looking for KY competition. This will be good for Fleming-Neon & Jenkins area gridiron players especially since both programs have been way way down for years now. Jenkins' head coach left just prior to one season not too long ago that was beginning to start & the whole schedule was scrapped...they didn't play a game. Sorry, back on subject...this won't be much of a game IMHO. Grundy will take a 30+ point win tonight, would be more if the weather wasn't supposed to be inclimate.

No offense meant, but I'll believe it when I see it in the sports section the following day.

Grundy10, you are right, Sheldon Clark's one win this year so far did come over Bourbon County (currently 0-3) instead of East Ridge, who they haven't played & not sure if they will. I stand corrected, thanks for the heads up.

Lance, I enjoy this board just as I enjoy keeping up with SWD football even though GC is unfortunately not a part of it any longer. Hopefully some day GC will be back playing the Graham's, Grundy's, Tazewell's & Richlands' of the world. I know I wouldn't be the only one happy if this does take place. I also enjoy this board because you can have a decent & intelligent conversation about SWVA football by speaking your mind without idiocy abounding. I help moderate a board currently that I honestly can't say the same about. What BigD4VT referred to about certain people downing Richlands for losing to a single A team that lost 18 seniors from last year had a lot to do with the tone of my posting. I wasn't alone with unexpected joy when we came out with the victory against the Blues in how the Devils played. Honestly I was upset with myself for doubting them. When I came onto the board the next day, a poster from Grundy was more or less giving both teams down the road, negative comments thrown here and there, most of them obviously incorrect by anyone without extreme bias. I knew Richlands has a good team & the Devils have a lot to improve upon. There's probably not many more people more critical of a team's performanace as a spectator as I happen to be. I just found those comments made by the poster run all over me like hot water on my back. I always root for the Orginal SWD Four when they face others from outside the district, whether it be Grundy, Graham, Tazewell or Richlands. There's a lot of good memories & great tradition from the old SWD that always makes me feel proud when any of them excel. I remember when I got out of the service & went back to college & worked in a restaurant in Kingsport. Joe Cundiff (Graham QB in the 80's) came in with a group of people & I went over & started talking SWD football with him. He seemed interested in talking but I think it weirded him out that I knew so much about him, much less knowing who he was in the first place lol. No harm, no foul here on my end. The only reason I went into a rant in the thread above was due to the continued comparison (almost completely negative in context) of GC within postings. I, like the rest of you, am proud of my school/football program/etc. Maybe too proud, I don't know. I guess sometimes it's just a part of our past that we cherish in memory & continue to support due to that reason. I'm done, sorry so lengthy. Good luck to the Wave against Paintsville this Friday, show them what good SWD/SWVA smashmouth is all about.

I don't think anyone in their right mind thinks Grundy isn't a good football team. I also don't think anyone in their right mind thinks Richlands isn't a good football team either. That being said, I honestly don't think that Grundy has a tougher schedule than Richlands...this year. Yes, Paintsville has a good team this year, however, Sheldon Clark is 1-3 with a victory over 1-3 East Ridge who is a consolidated school from two smaller schools that neither had a football program before combining. Shelby Valley is 1-2 with a win over winless Pineville. Sheldon Clark finished 8-4 last year while Shelby Valley finished at 5-6. Lebanon has a good football program in my opinion, maybe others disagree...but that is what forums like this are for. They are 2-0 presently & defeated a pretty good Tazewell team (at least I think they are pretty good, opinions may vary). The Dawgs did stay within at least 21 points of the Blues & gave them fits for most of the game. Lee High's program is in disarray, I don't think anyone would question that. The playoff loss that Sheldon Clark suffered last year was to the same program that Lee High lost to this past Friday night (Middlesboro), and the final outcome of that game was close to the same point margin that S. Clark faced in 2003. I'm sure S. Clark isn't the same team they were last year, but neither is Lee High, Grundy, Richlands, Graham, et al for that matter. I would love it if Gate City was geographically located near the SWD schools so that the Devils could play in that district. I've made that very comment on this forum in that past as well. I as well as most GC fans miss AA ball. Racking "A" titles? GC has four, 3 coming in AA. I would hardly say that GC had to drop to single A to win a state championship. It seems to me as if some on this forum, especially Grundy fans, try to talk negatively about Gate City in attempt to make themselves look good. How you make that correlation is beyond me, and probably beyond anyone else that knows the history between GC & Grundy. I guess the 19-2 series record GC has against Grundy may have something to do with the trash talk of Wave fans. Last victory over GC by Grundy was in 1960. Some information to chew on a while. Not trying to start an argument, but GC's record against: Tazewell 19-8 Graham 19-15 Richlands 20-14-1 I hardly think that wanting to go single A to supposedly "rack up state titles" came to mind when whoever within the Scott Co. school system decided to have them drop. When & if Virginia High (who has close to 100 more in enrollment than GC) drops to Single A as recommended by the VH$L, will you be saying the same thing about their program...wanting to rack up titles? How about Floyd & Grayson County? They have a larger enrollment than Gate City, are they racking up state titles? They are all three more centrally located to more AA programs than GC. Lance, why aren't you dogging those three schools? I welcome VHS if they come to the LPD as planned, although it has already been said in newspaper articles that VHS will fight it to join the Hogo due to geography. Hmmm...geography...you think that might have been a reason for GC finally stopping the petitioning to play AA ball with numbers considered single A by the VHSL. Nah, not you and probably not anyone else trying to validate a rivalry loss by downing another school not even in the mix as far as SWD play is concerned.

I'm not even a Powell Valley fan & don't have a horse in this race, but I can assure you that there were not 4 referees that graduated from PV on the field this past Friday night. In fact, there aren't even 4 referees that call any LPD games or in SWVA within the VHSL association for that matter that reside or graduated from BSG/PV. The VHSL also has rules/regulations that do not permit referees that have ties (graduates, kids on the team, etc.) from calling games that involve said school(s). It might make for interesting water cooler gossip at work, but this isn't factual information that was passed on to you. Almost every loss by any school, the fingers are pointed at the officiating. You see it on VAPreps, CoachT, KYPreps, the LPD Forum, this board, etc. This is just human nature, mostly that involves sports fans throughout not just our country but throughout the world for that matter. I caught the last half of the PV/North game & though there were some calls that could go either way, I did not feel they were biased in any shape or form. North handled themselves well on the field, but both teams play was very sloppy at times IMHO. I am sure opponents of Sullivan North have complained of officiating following a loss to the Golden Raiders. Good luck to our neighbors in Bloomingdale & Lynn Garden the rest of the season, I hope they have a successful 2004 campaign on the gridiron.

Gate City did play poorly against Coeburn, but the score at half was 27-0. The score was never 21-7. Colobro pulled the starters with more than eight minutes left in the third period. Coeburn never got past GC's 35 with the first team defense in the game. In the fourth quarter, both second and third teams for each respective school finished the game out. Final score 46-16. These aren't excuses, only facts. Were you even in attendance at this particular game? I sincerely doubt it. See if you can put come factual and accurate information together for at least one sentence. People can sometimes look like idiots when they don't even know what they are talking about (et tu, Chubz?)

I don't think myself or anyone said Tazewell wasn't good. My post was that Richlands & Tazewell can not face each other in the post-season as the previous poster was implying. Damn, some people...

That's not possible. Richlands is Division 4, while Tazewell is Division 3.

Waveman92, I never said anything derogatory about Grundy's football team, never said they were not good or tough for that matter. I know they have a very good chance at winning the SWD, I think everyone realizes that. I also don't have anything against people from Grundy, there are some good quality people from up there...never met anyone from Grundy I didn't like. I dated a girl from Raven back in my teenage days; the music director at my church growing up was a lady from Grundy that I have much respect for, play softball & golf with some buddies from up there often as well. My reply was to jmarcum & him alone, no more no less. Some friends of mine from Clintwood filled me in on the scrimmage with the Wave. I honestly think it may come down to Grundy & Richlands (JMHO). I know the Marcum brothers are good players, don't know them personally but I am sure they are fine young men. The opening post made by jmarcum showed his lack of knowledge, most notably that GC "lost a lot of players" to injury. Some of the young men did come out of the game with muscle cramps, the temperature on the bank in town was 91* at 6 p.m. Sometimes players at GC do have muscle cramps, not sure if that happens to other team's players as well. The Devils did lose 18 seniors to graduation this past year & only returned one offensive starter, that being a guard. Most GC supporters were not sure on what to expect last night. GC had some bright spots in the scrimmage & jamboree, but they also had several problems that need(ed) to be ironed out as well. I'll be honest, what I heard about the Blues I thought we were going to be in for a long night. Richlands has a very good team, no doubt. I, of course, was happy with the determination & heart of a young GC squad. The comments from jmarcum were obviously a biased cheapshot at a rebuilding program that had success against the Wave when they faced each other in the past & at a Richlands team that IMO will be a formidable opponent for SWD teams this year. As far as PV & Clintwood is concerned, GC fans realize they have great teams this year & if the Devils don't bring our "A" game as it has been referred to on other boards, our team may come out with a loss. Powell Valley returned 15/16 out of 22 starting postions, 19-20 seniors on the roster. Clintwood is always a tough draw & have made a good showing in pre-season and last night, always leaving it all out on the field. But the bright side is that games aren't played on a internet message board forum, they are played on the field. Hopefully we can upset one of these two this upcoming season. With that said, hopefully you can understand my emphatic reply to the elder marcum. It was tasteless, uninformative, full of inaccuracies & bias...as always when posted my Mr. jmarcum. ...I apologize for being so long-winded

Hell, I never heard of a player missing the rest of the season after having muscle cramps in Week 1. Maybe they do in Grundy, but they don't down here. Go watch your Golden Wave play that "tough opponent" in Sheldon Clark tonight and thump your chest on here after the game. You might as well be playing the Sisters of Mercy. You try and act like you know so much about football, but your postings on here and VAPreps say otherwise. You wouldn't know your arse from a hole in the ground. Your condescending comments make it tough to root for an old SWD foe, unlike Tazewell, Richlands, Graham, et al. But really, anyone who reads your crap on internet boards wouldn't expect anything good to come out of your keyboard about Gate City or Richlands...there are reasons for such negative talk about both programs from you, aren't they? Richlands has owned Grundy on the football field for at least the past 3-4 years and Gate City has a all-time series record of 19-2 against the Golden Wave. Call it jealousy, call it hatred, call it envy...no matter, it doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out you are an idiot. On another note, good luck to Richlands this year, they have a very good football team & I wish them the best. Neither team deserved to lose last night.

G-Man and other Graham fans that might be making the trip down to Gate City tomorrow, come over to the home side and give us a shout. I don't think you will have a hard time picking us out of the crowd You guys have a safe trip coming down the road, it will feel like old times having the G-Men & their loyal fans within the friendly confines of Legion Field once again.

Here's a link to the 2003 roster, complete with grade status: http://scott.k12.va.us/gchsfootball/03roster.htm

Hmmmm...DaddyCas...wonder who that may happen to be...?

No Jimmy, I like him just where he is, coaching GC football.

From the numbers I gathered, it currently stands at 192-60-1

Well, considering that I am from Gate City, graduated from Gate City & have family in Gate City as well as have other family members, friends & acquaintances attending GCHS I believe I know those numbers are correct for grades 10-12. When you have graduating classes between 140-160, normally your enrollment in grades 10-12 will fall in that category. You still haven't replied to the posters question of why PV doesn't play up at AA as well if Gate City should be. I replied to your initial posting with accurate documented facts & figures while you responded with unfounded allegations & conspiracy theories immediately after a Powell Valley loss to Gate City in football. I believe I will leave it at that & let others be the judge. One last comment, I feel that GC's football program had decent success in the AA ranks in the past, maybe I am wrong on that account. I am not fishing for compliments, only wanting someone other than a GC fan/alumnus/has-been to validate my claim that GC had decent football before leaving AA after the 2000 season. Graham, Tazewell, Grundy, Richlands & others have also had great seasons & either have or had great programs. If those others could help me out here, was Gate City struggling in AA football when they ceased petitioning the VHSL to hold an AA status like the thread initiator claims?

There are currently 40 schools participating in Division 2 football across the state, with Region C Grayson County @ 606 at the highest & Rye Cove the lowest at 194. We are all in agreement it is unfair for RC, but would you not agree that is a wide margin for a classification? Here is some enrollment numbers, beginning with the highest: Grayson County 606 Central Woodstock 544 James Monroe 526 Wilson Memorial 517 Washington & Lee 500 Arcadia 493 Chatham 488 Nelson County 474 Manassas Park 469 Floyd County 469 Goochland 453 Gate City 453 Randolph-Henry 451 Clark County 451 George Mason 451 That is a listing of 40% of the schools in Division 2. Why does people always want to complain about GC being in this division? Gate City petitioned to play up for years & finally decided not to petition for whatever reasons the powers that be decided upon. You don't have to petition to play in a division that your numbers place you into. Graham & Grundy could stop petitioning to play up as well, and if they did, I know GC fans would welcome it. We miss seeing the GC/Graham matchups, as they were always good hard fought games no matter what each teams records happen to be. In GC's first year of re-joining the LPD, both Powell Valley & J.J. Kelly were listed on the vhsl.org website as having a greater enrollment than Gate City. More often than not Powell Valley had a greater enrollment than Gate City during the 90's, this was also confirmed on vhsl.org's website. I am sure this wasn't brought up as an argument within Big Stone Gap during that time. Some people, mostly the younger set, don't realize that Gate City's football roots started out in the LPD in the early 60's (possibly late 50's). GC's move to AA came about in 1970 when classification came about. At that time, they did have AA numbers. Numbers have dropped significantly over the years & now have Single A numbers & have had Single A numbers for many years. I commend Graham, Tazewell & Grundy for playing AA ball. I am sure if GC was geographically located as close to these schools as they are to each other, GC would be in the SWD today playing Group AA football. Unfortunately that is not the case. Trust me, there are more GC football fans than not that would like to be located closer to SWD schools than we currently happen to be. The VHSL moved Rye Cove into Division 2 due to their enrollment being 6-8 students more in grades 10-12 than the previous Division 2 school Castlewood. The VHSL wanted Region D to have 9 Div. 1 & 9 Div. 2 schools, so RC moved up while Castlewood moved down. I don't agree with having RC in Div. 1 & neither do they. They have to play the cards that are dealt to them. Not meaning to cause a ruckus by posting these, you can form your own opinion, it really doesn't matter to me.

...in his win this past Saturday. I know that Carlock & Fry are friends & have mutual admiration for each other. Good luck to the G-Men the remainder of the season in your pursuit of a championship.