Graham football 2009??

[GMan 3,569]

I went to Graham and as I said, the Big G Marching Band hasn't been good since Jimmy Jones was directing them...and yes, Richlands' band IS better...heck, Bluefield's band is better and they only have 25 kids...

[ghstoga 10]

G-Man..c'mon now you don't seriously think Blfd's band is better than Graham's do you? I haven't seen Richlands band so I can't comment on them....but Graham's band is pretty good.

[beano5 14]

I went to Graham and as I said, the Big G Marching Band hasn't been good since Jimmy Jones was directing them...and yes, Richlands' band IS better...heck, Bluefield's band is better and they only have 25 kids...

 

we were good up until the 2004-2005 school year. then we got an assistant band director who didnt let us play music. since then its been allllll down hill

[VTCC22 10]

The band is much bigger at GHS than football right now...

 

Truth is, people only go to the G-Man football games to watch the band. Thats the only entertainment there is around here. All of you have seen them play. Noone wants to watch David get sacked the whole game because of a terrible line. Noone wants to see the running backs fall down before someone even attempts to tackle them. Barry Sanders couldnt even help them out. So truly the band is the only reason most people go to the games. Of course Im not speaking for everyone.

Edited March 18, 2009 by VTCC22

[Guest Moore31]

Why are you talking about the band. We are suppose to be talking about football. if you want to tal about the band go to the other sports section. if you can call it a sport.

[duhwhat 10]

this is too funny ..................i didnt think i would ever read so much about the bands in a sports site..................LOL

[Guest Moore31]

i know what you mean. the only time i listen to the band is at halftime and that is if i just do not have anything to do.....;););););)

[VTCC22 10]

Why are you talking about the band. We are suppose to be talking about football. if you want to tal about the band go to the other sports section. if you can call it a sport.

 

If you actually read my thread instead of the first line you would see that I was still talking about the football team. I was merely comparing the excitement of the team as opposed to the band. BAND IS BY NO MEANS A SPORT!!!

[unc_fan32 10]

who cares about "kyle harris"... He is not that great of a football player he is got speed but no size ghram might be a little better next year but probably not!!! they could be get that idoit coach outte there!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! GO TYLER CROUSE

 

who cares about "kooper"..... why do people get on here and talk so much trash.........0oooooo i get it people get on here, make up a fake account, and talk trash because they have nothin better to do. harris isn't the best but he did help them out a lil bit.........so give him a lil bit of credit. but until you(kooper) can get out on a football field and even play the game dont talk trash about any player.

[GMan 3,569]

people get on here, make up a fake account, and talk trash because they have nothin better to do.

 

Actually people get on here and make REAL accounts under FAKE names...and you're right, its because we have nothing better to do...even though some of us should be working instead of surfing...:eek:

[futbolking 766]

Truth is, people only go to the G-Man football games to watch the band. Thats the only entertainment there is around here. All of you have seen them play. Noone wants to watch David get sacked the whole game because of a terrible line. Noone wants to see the running backs fall down before someone even attempts to tackle them. Barry Sanders couldnt even help them out. So truly the band is the only reason most people go to the games. Of course Im not speaking for everyone.

 

nailed it... I know of several people who go just to watch their kids in the band. People who have been watching the team for years and years have gotten disgusted with things lately and don't even bother going to see them play. I hope things turn around soon.

[futbolking 766]

If you actually read my thread instead of the first line you would see that I was still talking about the football team. I was merely comparing the excitement of the team as opposed to the band. BAND IS BY NO MEANS A SPORT!!!

 

 

 

I wouldn't bet against them, if they geared up and went head to head with the football team.

But, next year is a new season...so we'll see, the potential is there to do well.

[Deleted Account 5,203]

If you actually read my thread instead of the first line you would see that I was still talking about the football team. I was merely comparing the excitement of the team as opposed to the band. BAND IS BY NO MEANS A SPORT!!!

 

If you only knew about that which you have no idea.

Go and Google "DCI", and tell me that band's not a sport.

In fact, I'll do it here: http://www.dci.org/

18-20 hour days, 20-minute meals, marching for 10-12 of those hours in the summer heat.

Edited March 24, 2009 by UVAObserver

[deuceswild 15]

Band is not a sport.

 

An activity? Yes.

[wvuraiders 10]

Actually people get on here and make REAL accounts under FAKE names...and you're right, its because we have nothing better to do...even though some of us should be working instead of surfing...:eek:

 

exactly what i was thinking.

[SteveEurkel 11]

Graham's Football Program has been run straight into the ground by Doug Marrs. I remember the first team he took over after Carlock died was the team that could've went to state but his playbook consists of 4-6 plays that get him no where. Grahams players are very capable of being a good team but there coaching isn't there. Aren't there many coaches on that team that are recent former players from Graham?? That doesn't seem like too much of a great coaching staff. If Bluefield, Va wants Graham to get back to its winning ways then they won't spend money on equipment they don't need, they'll pay for a new coach. And yes some kids in school that should be playing aren't but they kids that want to be COACHED are there and aren't seeing results from hard work.

[Deleted Account 5,203]

Band is not a sport.

 

An activity? Yes.

 

Completely, fully disagree.

 

There's physical exertion in competitive marching bands. There's a high level of competition the more time you put into it. The cream of the crop (that is, DCI) train intensively and do routine scheduled (and complex) breathing exercises in order to advance both their music playing and their cardiovascular output. This is aside of music rehearsals which occur behind closed doors.

 

I bet you say that band is merely an "activity" because you've never experienced the rigors of a competitive marching band. If band isn't a sport, then neither is gymnastics/fencing/skating/wrestling or any other such sport where one doesn't advance a ball down a field.

 

I've been through it, and I've lived through it, in high school and especially in college. Until you have, it's so easy to say that it's not a sport. One 18-hour day would change your mind.

[Cornholio 10]

Graham's Football Program has been run straight into the ground by Doug Marrs. I remember the first team he took over after Carlock died was the team that could've went to state but his playbook consists of 4-6 plays that get him no where. Grahams players are very capable of being a good team but there coaching isn't there. Aren't there many coaches on that team that are recent former players from Graham?? That doesn't seem like too much of a great coaching staff. If Bluefield, Va wants Graham to get back to its winning ways then they won't spend money on equipment they don't need, they'll pay for a new coach. And yes some kids in school that should be playing aren't but they kids that want to be COACHED are there and aren't seeing results from hard work.

 

Eark; loosen them suspenders a bit; you are cutting off the blood running to your brain. The argument whether Doug Marrs is good, bad, great, mediocre, brilliant can (and will) be argued till the day he relinquishes the job. I even recall when the locals were wanting Coach Carlock's scalp. Bluefield Virginia can raise all the money they want to and buy or not buy all the equipment they want to but no amount of money they raise will even remotely have an impact on who coaches the football team......it doesn't work that way.

[deuceswild 15]

Completely, fully disagree.

 

There's physical exertion in competitive marching bands. There's a high level of competition the more time you put into it. The cream of the crop (that is, DCI) train intensively and do routine scheduled (and complex) breathing exercises in order to advance both their music playing and their cardiovascular output. This is aside of music rehearsals which occur behind closed doors.

 

I bet you say that band is merely an "activity" because you've never experienced the rigors of a competitive marching band. If band isn't a sport, then neither is gymnastics/fencing/skating/wrestling or any other such sport where one doesn't advance a ball down a field.

 

I've been through it, and I've lived through it, in high school and especially in college. Until you have, it's so easy to say that it's not a sport. One 18-hour day would change your mind.

 

I was in the band for 16 years and played high school and collegiate sports.

 

Band isn't one of them nor is it close.

 

Wrestling, fencing, skating, and gymnastics are all sports (I never said they weren't, go ahead and scroll up, I typed two sentences). You assumed incorrectly as I've noticed you do in several of your posts. You're correct, however, that none of those sports require balls of the non-anatomical variety.

 

My sister was also in the band at UVA (you might even know her?) she would laugh hysterically if it were called a "sport" just because you have to breathe "properly". I guess having a baby or being an astronaut are also sports?

 

I'm not saying its a "sissy activity" but no school, nor the VHSL, nor myself, nor any college recognizes it as a sport. It can be competitive...but so can chess, phase10, and UNO. No disrespect to band, I dabbled in it for several years. It demands you to be in physical and mental shape. But I hesitate to categorize it as a sport, but it is an activity.. and a good one at that.

 

18 hours of band? Haha, please. I would die for 18 hours of band, try 18 hours of boot camp. I would blow a sax for 3 days straight to avoid some of those drills.

 

Did you ever play a high school sport other than ....band, UVAObserver?

Edited March 25, 2009 by deuceswild

[Deleted Account 5,203]

I was in the band for 16 years and played high school and collegiate sports.

 

Band isn't one of them nor is it close.

 

Wrestling, fencing, skating, and gymnasttics are all sports (I never said they weren't, go ahead and scroll up, I typed two sentences). You assumed incorrectly as I've noticed you do in several of your posts. You're correct, however, that none of those sports require balls of the non-anatomical variety.

 

My sister was also in the band at UVA (you might even know her?) she would laugh hysterically if it were called a "sport" just because you have to breathe "properly". I guess having a baby or being an astronaut are also sports?

 

I'm not saying its a "sissy activity" but no school, nor the VHSL, nor myself, nor any college recognizes it as a sport. It can be competitive...but so can chess, phase10, and UNO. No disrespect to band, I dabbled in it for several years. It demands you to be in physical and mental shape. But I hesitate to categorize it as a sport, but it is an activity.. and a good one at that.

 

18 hours of band? Haha, please. I would die for 18 hours of band, try 18 hours of boot camp. I would blow a sax for 3 days straight to avoid some of those drills.

 

Did you ever play a high school sport other than ....band, UVAObserver?

 

It's probably better for me to respond to your points in order, as there are many.

 

1. I know you never said that gymnastics et. al. were sports, and I never stated that you did. I think your proverbial pot is calling my proverbial kettle black regarding my posting history (which, interestingly, you've never commented about/had a problem with before). I was making a comparison all my own to other sports where one requires specialized physical training in order to effectively compete. Many do marching band for nothing more than the social aspect of it, and that's the way it is. However, if you want to perform at your apex, you train both physically and mentally to be on the top of your game. I think we agree on this point, yes. I did exercises in the summer in college to get ready for the fall marching season, and my section-mates and I hit up the gym as often as we could. Many universities, including UVA, don't have competitive marching bands. Many universities (see JMU, etc.) do so. DCI does as well, and I've had the stories recanted to me and confirmed often.

 

2. I might know your sister, perhaps. If she's a 3rd-year or older, certainly. If she's a 2nd-year or younger, it's quite doubtful. But I'd place a huge wager that if your sister feels this way as you merely speculate, she doesn't have to push air through 18 feet of silver/nickel tubing as I did, either; I'd also conjecture that she's a woodwind, which doesn't require NEARLY as much air or as much strength/agility as what I played. We had professional musicians, DCI section leaders, and other high school marching band instructors come and work with my section specifically on proper breathing; if you don't breathe properly with an instrument that large, you either don't play or you pass out. We had many of the same show us proper marching technic when swinging around 35-pound horns. Many either don't care or don't pay attention, as I've mentioned with simply being there for the social aspect. Maybe it's a low brass thing, but we took it seriously. Percussion and tubas always do.

 

3. I've had military guys in my section or in the low brass in general. Army, Marines, and Air Force. Had one fresh from the army the very first year the band existed at UVA. I was curious and asked him how it compared to basic training, and I still remember what Dustin said: "It's not as hard, but it's closer than you'd think". I am unsure if you went to boot camp, from your post I can only imply that you have. Knowing others who have done both, their recollections do not coincide with your claim and not-so-coy disparaging remark.

 

4. I played high school baseball, as a matter of fact, yes. So there's a 'universally-recognized' sport, for reference. There's absolutely no comparison: the work I did with that band in Charlottesville far trumps anything work I ever did on the baseball diamond. But then again, I played at Graham. *Insert joke here*. I digress. I played football up through middle school, I've bowled, I've been in band: it's not exactly as if I'm some sloth message board hero taking pot-shots. But I see what you've done here. It didn't work.

 

To insert a new point, I wanted to see what commonly-accepted, objective definitions of "sport" meant. They bolster my argument. Please PM me if you find objective evidence to the contrary of these widely-accepted definitions of "sport".

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/sport

http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/sport%5B2%5D

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sport

 

I do appreciate your opinion, but I do not appreciate some of the shots you've taken at me here instead of my points of dispute. I believe we're going to have to agree to disagree on this issue, especially as you've presented little, if any, objective evidence which would force me to reconsider my stance. Good day to you.

Edited March 25, 2009 by UVAObserver

[Blondie 10]

You also have to remember that the coaches aren't the ones on the field playing. Yes coaching is half of football but the other half is execution and thats up to the players. you could have the worlds best coach but if the players don't execute then that makes the coach look bad

[Blondie 10]

Graham's Football Program has been run straight into the ground by Doug Marrs. I remember the first team he took over after Carlock died was the team that could've went to state but his playbook consists of 4-6 plays that get him no where. Grahams players are very capable of being a good team but there coaching isn't there. Aren't there many coaches on that team that are recent former players from Graham?? That doesn't seem like too much of a great coaching staff. If Bluefield, Va wants Graham to get back to its winning ways then they won't spend money on equipment they don't need, they'll pay for a new coach. And yes some kids in school that should be playing aren't but they kids that want to be COACHED are there and aren't seeing results from hard work.

You also have to remember that the coaches aren't the ones on the field playing. Yes coaching is half of football but the other half is execution and thats up to the players. you could have the worlds best coach but if the players don't execute then that makes the coach look bad

[CPF 416]

You also have to remember that the coaches aren't the ones on the field playing. Yes coaching is half of football but the other half is execution and thats up to the players. you could have the worlds best coach but if the players don't execute then that makes the coach look bad

 

 

 

And I guess they just quit executing these last couple of years. I love when these people make excuses for why we are where we are. It has been a steady progression down hill since 2005. A coaching record that started off 16-8 now sits at 25-21. The kids that have been groomed for two years have a record of 9-13. This should be the payoff year, but it won't be, and 2010 will be doomsday. We had 5 freshman come out for football in 2008, five........think about that........In 30 years I have never saw anything close to that number. Why?

[SteveEurkel 11]

You also have to remember that the coaches aren't the ones on the field playing. Yes coaching is half of football but the other half is execution and thats up to the players. you could have the worlds best coach but if the players don't execute then that makes the coach look bad

 

True. But the coaches put the players in the position to make the right plays and the coaching staff hasn't done that. Doug Marrs has 5 very predicitable plays. He doesn't train his players in any way, he just makes them lift and lift and lift and yes they do get bigger (not like the old Graham teams) but they get bigger with NO speed. Thats why teams like Bluefield and Richlands and teams that have athletes kill graham. Yes Grahams players have the talent but they have no coaching. Thats what it comes down to. The players aren't taught that mentally tough attitude that past Graham teams have had.

[deuceswild 15]

It's probably better for me to respond to your points in order, as there are many.

 

1. I know you never said that gymnastics et. al. were sports, and I never stated that you did. I think your proverbial pot is calling my proverbial kettle black regarding my posting history (which, interestingly, you've never commented about/had a problem with before). I was making a comparison all my own to other sports where one requires specialized physical training in order to effectively compete. Many do marching band for nothing more than the social aspect of it, and that's the way it is. However, if you want to perform at your apex, you train both physically and mentally to be on the top of your game. I think we agree on this point, yes. I did exercises in the summer in college to get ready for the fall marching season, and my section-mates and I hit up the gym as often as we could. Many universities, including UVA, don't have competitive marching bands. Many universities (see JMU, etc.) do so. DCI does as well, and I've had the stories recanted to me and confirmed often.

 

2. I might know your sister, perhaps. If she's a 3rd-year or older, certainly. If she's a 2nd-year or younger, it's quite doubtful. But I'd place a huge wager that if your sister feels this way as you merely speculate, she doesn't have to push air through 18 feet of silver/nickel tubing as I did, either; I'd also conjecture that she's a woodwind, which doesn't require NEARLY as much air or as much strength/agility as what I played. We had professional musicians, DCI section leaders, and other high school marching band instructors come and work with my section specifically on proper breathing; if you don't breathe properly with an instrument that large, you either don't play or you pass out. We had many of the same show us proper marching technic when swinging around 35-pound horns. Many either don't care or don't pay attention, as I've mentioned with simply being there for the social aspect. Maybe it's a low brass thing, but we took it seriously. Percussion and tubas always do.

 

3. I've had military guys in my section or in the low brass in general. Army, Marines, and Air Force. Had one fresh from the army the very first year the band existed at UVA. I was curious and asked him how it compared to basic training, and I still remember what Dustin said: "It's not as hard, but it's closer than you'd think". I am unsure if you went to boot camp, from your post I can only imply that you have. Knowing others who have done both, their recollections do not coincide with your claim and not-so-coy disparaging remark.

 

4. I played high school baseball, as a matter of fact, yes. So there's a 'universally-recognized' sport, for reference. There's absolutely no comparison: the work I did with that band in Charlottesville far trumps anything work I ever did on the baseball diamond. But then again, I played at Graham. *Insert joke here*. I digress. I played football up through middle school, I've bowled, I've been in band: it's not exactly as if I'm some sloth message board hero taking pot-shots. But I see what you've done here. It didn't work.

 

To insert a new point, I wanted to see what commonly-accepted, objective definitions of "sport" meant. They bolster my argument. Please PM me if you find objective evidence to the contrary of these widely-accepted definitions of "sport".

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/sport

http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/sport%5B2%5D

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sport

 

I do appreciate your opinion, but I do not appreciate some of the shots you've taken at me here instead of my points of dispute. I believe we're going to have to agree to disagree on this issue, especially as you've presented little, if any, objective evidence which would force me to reconsider my stance. Good day to you.

 

 

Alright UVAObserver, here we go. So, while I refuse to dispute the dictionary you so gracefully dropped upon me, I can confidently say that I see your claim. Marching Band, if using the definitions you provided (I admit, I only read one. You've seen one definition for "sport", I figure you've seen them all, right?), can be "loosely" considered a sport. By that definition, one could say lots of things are sports. (e.g. Child birth, paper football, Riverdance, windmills, guitar hero, competitive eating (I would probably even consider that one for real), endurance beer drinking, and I even found "Marching Band" listed on Wikipedia's list of sports but so was backgammon). So while I would think you would want to distinguish Marching Band from backgammon, perhaps it is a sport if that is what you want it to be. But I thought to myself, even considering this definition, how many would actually consider it a sport using our modern ways of thinking and our modern day schema for the word. So, I set up a survey within the VT Survey service provided at survey.vt.edu and did a small, subjective evaluation. I had my friends forward it out to other folks in the band and anyone they knew that were willing to take the time to fill it out for me. There was also a comments box at the end and 11 people left comments which I didn't post here in lieu of space.

The results are as follows:

There were 37 total entries.

43% were Undergrad, 43% were graduate, 5% were neither.

(Nice dichotomy if I say so myself)

 

16% were or had been in the VT band, 24% had been in the ROTC band, and 59% were in neither.

 

49% were in the band in high school, 51% were not

 

I then provided the definition proposed by the Merriam-Webster link you provided and asked "Considering this definition, would you still consider marching band to be a sport?"

92% said no, 8% said yes.

 

If you would like to see the existence of this survey and the results please PM ME and I will gladly show them to you.

 

I also scoped 57 high school websites in Virginia, Kentucky, and Tennessee. 21 of the ones I viewed labeled their "Sports" as "Sports" and several others used "Athletics". But for either, I did not find band listed anywhere. I did however find band in categories such as "Clubs", "Activities", and just regular old "Band".

 

I did the same for 32 universities. Still no band.

 

So roughly 92% of an infinitesimal sample of Virginia Tech alum and current students still don't believe band is a sport and neither do 100% of the universities and high schools I looked at. I think most people interpret it as an interest or an art set into physical motion. Perhaps it should be universally regarded as a sport, I mean Wikipedia is on your side, and if that is your argument that is fine. But as of now, its not one in the public eye, including my own.

 

Now, to the personal jabs. I don't have problems with you or your posts...usually. I think its fair to say your posts, while often appearing to be short-worded and a mere "two-cents" to get your post count up, they are often insightful. More than I can say for one of my usual posts. You're a bright guy, no one would dispute that. My problem is (as I stated before) that I see a lot of misguided or misinformed assumptions. I try to avoid assumptions the best I can, I'm comfortable enough to admit I'm not bright enough to make assumptions if I have no evidence for backing them up. So for example, and what really sticks out to me, is that you questioned my military background. You have no idea about me or my military background, I even offer to say that I doubt you care. But I do have one, its not worth your time to question it. Also, probably to "toot" your own horn (pun intended) you made a subtle suggestion that your instrument was more physically demanding than my sisters. She played trombone for what its worth. Its not a tuba, but its not wooden either. Oh and she graduated in '93, so you may not know her after all..?

 

I don't want you to reconsider your stance however I have provided you with exactly what you asked for. Evidence toward my claim that marching band is not regarded as and probably never will be universally regarded as a sport no matter how bad you wish it to be or however many Merriam-Webster definitions you throw out suggesting otherwise. According to the Wikipedia link you sent me, you can refer to anything as a sport. Which is why I'm going to add "Paper-football" and "Rock, Paper, Scissors" to the list with Marching Band.

 

Again, if you don't believe in the authenticity of my survey and if you still care (I doubt you do, come on, we both have better things to ramble on about) PM me and we can see what we can do without you having a VT Login, even if it's just screen-shots.

 

 

Oh, and I apologize for the off-topic posts. Go Graham Football in 2009!!