SteveEurkel 11 Report Share Posted April 9, 2011 Should be looking for coaches now, if they were to promote within the program then it would totally defeat the purpose. Everything Doug did at Graham needs to be replaced, I would go out on the limb and say that the entire coaching staff needs to be well thought through. Bring in someone that can better the coaching staff and not continue this misery that we in Bluefield have dealt with for some time now!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frito gonzales 103 Report Share Posted April 9, 2011 I think coaches Palmer, Bradshaw, and Henry should stay. They are good guys who are smart coaches and the players respect them. I'm not sure they bought into what Marrs was doing there anyway. As long as Jones is gone, Graham will be better. But it would be good to see a new coach brought in from out of the area who knows more than 10 plays like what we've seen under Marrs and Jones. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lance 228 Report Share Posted April 9, 2011 going to be strange if Graham changes the playbook...been watching the Carlock formations since I was in high school. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveEurkel 11 Report Share Posted April 17, 2011 Exactly why Graham is a rock bottom team....... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
futbolking 766 Report Share Posted April 17, 2011 Hold on a second.....Graham being a rock bottom team has NOTHING to do with what Coach Carlock did....He may not have had much of a playbook...but he instilled discipline and hard work and those kids knew their assignments and were WINNERS. People who played under Carlock will tell you that practice was always much harder than the games...and they respected him. Graham hardly ever gave up more than 20 points in a game....much less the 40 and 50 point embarassments put up here lately. It has nothing to do with the playbook and everything to do with leadership!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lance 228 Report Share Posted April 17, 2011 Hold on a second.....Graham being a rock bottom team has NOTHING to do with what Coach Carlock did....He may not have had much of a playbook...but he instilled discipline and hard work and those kids knew their assignments and were WINNERS. People who played under Carlock will tell you that practice was always much harder than the games...and they respected him. Graham hardly ever gave up more than 20 points in a game....much less the 40 and 50 point embarassments put up here lately. It has nothing to do with the playbook and everything to do with leadership!! agree...it will just be strange to see them running the spread or something else full time instead of those inside trap plays...just seemed like Graham always had a Bradshaw or Jones that they made the focal point and ran the shoes off them...the years went by and you saw the same plays...and you knew what was coming...it was just fun trying to stop it...not much of that left anymore, kinda sad to see it go. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rebel1 35 Report Share Posted April 17, 2011 I can't say I have ever played graham and I have only watched them once, but when I hear people talk about graham (before here recently) it was always about how hard nosed and physical their teams were. I'd much rather run the rock down your throat as to this whole smoke and mirrors wing-t crap we ran. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
futbolking 766 Report Share Posted April 17, 2011 agree...it will just be strange to see them running the spread or something else full time instead of those inside trap plays...just seemed like Graham always had a Bradshaw or Jones that they made the focal point and ran the shoes off them...the years went by and you saw the same plays...and you knew what was coming...it was just fun trying to stop it...not much of that left anymore, kinda sad to see it go. I hear ya...I was responding to the dude that said the reason Graham was a rock bottom team was because they haven't changed the playbook...I miss the days of old when Graham would just run the ball down your throat and there was nothing the other team could do about it.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lance 228 Report Share Posted April 17, 2011 I hear ya...I was responding to the dude that said the reason Graham was a rock bottom team was because they haven't changed the playbook...I miss the days of old when Graham would just run the ball down your throat and there was nothing the other team could do about it.... Graham had great success under Carlock running those plays, so there is not much you can say about it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deleted Account 5,203 Report Share Posted April 17, 2011 Hold on a second.....Graham being a rock bottom team has NOTHING to do with what Coach Carlock did....He may not have had much of a playbook...but he instilled discipline and hard work and those kids knew their assignments and were WINNERS. People who played under Carlock will tell you that practice was always much harder than the games...and they respected him. Graham hardly ever gave up more than 20 points in a game....much less the 40 and 50 point embarassments put up here lately. It has nothing to do with the playbook and everything to do with leadership!! I think the correct answer lies somewhere between you and Eurkel. Closer to you, though. Most of it is leadership and discipline. Even when Graham was down in the mid-80s and had 2-8/3-7 teams, they were competitive and weren't getting blown out. Leadership and discipline can overcome talent gaps and make a team play at its highest. However, to say that the playbook has nothing to do with it isn't quite right, either. Most of the time, Carlock had the pure athletes to run 31-give straight down your throat. You don't need a deep playbook when you're just physically better than those against whom you line up. However, times change. As well as high school coaches can scout today, a slender playbook is a liability rather than an asset. It's a shame. I think we got cheated out of seeing how well Carlock would've done against Mance's juggernauts. Then, we would've truly seen just how far that thin playbook could ride. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
futbolking 766 Report Share Posted April 17, 2011 I think the correct answer lies somewhere between you and Eurkel. Closer to you, though. Most of it is leadership and discipline. Even when Graham was down in the mid-80s and had 2-8/3-7 teams, they were competitive and weren't getting blown out. Leadership and discipline can overcome talent gaps and make a team play at its highest. However, to say that the playbook has nothing to do with it isn't quite right, either. Most of the time, Carlock had the pure athletes to run 31-give straight down your throat. You don't need a deep playbook when you're just physically better than those against whom you line up. However, times change. As well as high school coaches can scout today, a slender playbook is a liability rather than an asset. It's a shame. I think we got cheated out of seeing how well Carlock would've done against Mance's juggernauts. Then, we would've truly seen just how far that thin playbook could ride. I see your point...and you're probably right. Fans always complained about Carlock running the ball up the middle all the time...but I think there was a method to his madness...in the 4th quarter, those teams were worn completely out and Graham's superior conditioning usually allowed them to pull out the close contests in the 4th quarter. I think his plan was to pound the opponents physically, keep it close and win it in the 2nd half... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CPF 411 Author Report Share Posted April 17, 2011 I think the correct answer lies somewhere between you and Eurkel. Closer to you, though. Most of it is leadership and discipline. Even when Graham was down in the mid-80s and had 2-8/3-7 teams, they were competitive and weren't getting blown out. Leadership and discipline can overcome talent gaps and make a team play at its highest. However, to say that the playbook has nothing to do with it isn't quite right, either. Most of the time, Carlock had the pure athletes to run 31-give straight down your throat. You don't need a deep playbook when you're just physically better than those against whom you line up. However, times change. As well as high school coaches can scout today, a slender playbook is a liability rather than an asset. It's a shame. I think we got cheated out of seeing how well Carlock would've done against Mance's juggernauts. Then, we would've truly seen just how far that thin playbook could ride. Graham never had a 2-8 season under Carlock, these were the only losing seasons.... 1973: 4-6 1983: 4-6 1987: 4-6 1988: 3-7 And just so you know, Mance started at Richlands in 1997. He only beat Glynn Carlock in 1998 and 2004. That makes him 6-2 vs Mance. Not taking anything away from Coach Mance and his accomplishments, but the truth is until Glynn died Graham beat Richlands. Which to me shows how great of a coach Glynn was to keep a guy like Mance at bay for so long. Mance has absolutely owned Marrs though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lance 228 Report Share Posted April 17, 2011 I know the trap plays set up the pass really well...for a lineman or linebacker it was frustrating, you couldn't see where the ball was but you knew where it was going, or should be going...the offense was pulling and cross blocking every play...you would get suckered in on it and then burned with a pass lol...it was simple, yet effective...more frustrating than anything....Giles is the same way with the single wing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrSocko 136 Report Share Posted April 17, 2011 I can't say I have ever played graham and I have only watched them once, but when I hear people talk about graham (before here recently) it was always about how hard nosed and physical their teams were. I'd much rather run the rock down your throat as to this whole smoke and mirrors wing-t crap we ran. I hate to tell ya' friend, but when you don't get in the weight room you can't run NOTHING down nobody's neck. You have to create blocking angles when you don't have the "meat" on the line and you guys also had little "scat backs" so you run what your talent provides and that is the wing-t. You can look at J I Burton, they run pretty much the same offense as you guys and they have been to 5 state title games. The team that I won't mention that beat Richlands in the title game also ran the jet sweeps. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redtiger 1,742 Report Share Posted April 18, 2011 Its very hard to just line up and run it down anybodys throat. Graham might have kept it between the tackles but they did it 3-4 different ways and always used double teams and angle blocking, thats the trick. Hurley runs alot of jet sweep but their counter off of the jet and their I formation stuff is straight man blocking(no angles) and that hurts them against tough teams. Burton has ran alot of jet the past 6-7 years but their counter plays and overall concept is/was alot different than Hurleys Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deleted Account 5,203 Report Share Posted April 18, 2011 Graham never had a 2-8 season under Carlock, these were the only losing seasons.... 1973: 4-6 1983: 4-6 1987: 4-6 1988: 3-7 And just so you know, Mance started at Richlands in 1997. He only beat Glynn Carlock in 1998 and 2004. That makes him 6-2 vs Mance. Not taking anything away from Coach Mance and his accomplishments, but the truth is until Glynn died Graham beat Richlands. Which to me shows how great of a coach Glynn was to keep a guy like Mance at bay for so long. Mance has absolutely owned Marrs though. Thanks for reminding me of the records before I was born and when I was in diapers. It doesn't change my original point, which was that even in Graham's losing seasons, they were still competitive. I know Mance started in '97. I also know Mance's teams started becoming competitive on a state level in 2004. Again, it doesn't change the original point: I would have loved to have seen a Carlock-coached football team against one of the recent Mance teams. It would have been a true test of a state-title-caliber offense and a state-title-caliber defense. I also think it's flawed to say that Carlock was the force that kept Mance at bay for so long. Carlock may have been the difference between 9-1 and 10-0 for those Richlands teams; however, Richlands jumped from 5-5/6-4 to 9-1/10-0. That's not ALL Carlock. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redtiger 1,742 Report Share Posted April 18, 2011 The talent level completly changed at both schools. One dropped and one rose, both dramatically. I think that had more to do w/ where the schools are currently at than coaching, although that obviously played a part Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frito gonzales 103 Report Share Posted April 18, 2011 For Graham the big difference is that under Carlock if you played football you lived in the weight room. It's not like that anymore. There are kids playing that hardly ever lift. That is one major reason that I think Graham has been in a major decline...along with the fact we had "the assistant coach of the year" running the program into the ground. Carlock got the most out of his players...like Mance probably does. Both coaches have the respect of their team and community. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GMan 3,569 Report Share Posted April 18, 2011 For Graham the big difference is that under Carlock if you played football you lived in the weight room. It's not like that anymore. There are kids playing that hardly ever lift. That is one major reason that I think Graham has been in a major decline...along with the fact we had "the assistant coach of the year" running the program into the ground. Carlock got the most out of his players...like Mance probably does. Both coaches have the respect of their team and community. Under Carlock...if you didn't lift, you didn't play...no ifs, ands, or buts...that's the way it was and it was understood by all that wanted to play... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
futbolking 766 Report Share Posted April 18, 2011 The talent level completly changed at both schools. One dropped and one rose, both dramatically. I think that had more to do w/ where the schools are currently at than coaching, although that obviously played a part I don't think "talent level" has anything to do with it....there's more talent walking the halls at Graham, than out on the field...nobody wants to play for the coaching staff....when you go from having 60 players to having just over 30....there's the problem.... Plus, when you stand around at practice with your hands on your hips....and don't lift weights or condition like you should, you end up with a soft team. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redtiger 1,742 Report Share Posted April 18, 2011 The weight room is a BIG factor in a programs success or lack of it. Alot of local teams go through ups and downs and most of that can be traced to the weight room Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warriors_XO 214 Report Share Posted April 18, 2011 Amen to that! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
futbolking 766 Report Share Posted April 18, 2011 For Graham the big difference is that under Carlock if you played football you lived in the weight room. It's not like that anymore. There are kids playing that hardly ever lift. That is one major reason that I think Graham has been in a major decline...along with the fact we had "the assistant coach of the year" running the program into the ground. Carlock got the most out of his players...like Mance probably does. Both coaches have the respect of their team and community. I may be wrong, but it seems like recently that every time I went by practice, the kids were standing around watching other kids run through plays....Too much down time...kids should be conditioning....running drills...etc...but what do I know?? A lot of hands on hips late in the game. In years past, the other teams were the ones who were worn down. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
.png.01bb665814ffc257795fe158cb2045c7.png.8a531ac878a82772b21014d7a6167582.png){kind=logo}
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.