Carroll County and redistricting

[sixcat 2,937]

Since I mentioned it, the politics of Carroll's inclusion in the SWD was pretty interesting.

 

With the formal demise of the New River District in the early 1990's, Blacksburg, Christiansburg, and Carroll were all courted by the SWD. Graham already had some pretty decent scheduling arrangements with the two 'Burgs and Richlands was having a hard time finding opponents and was happy to find guaranteed matchups (particularly in football) wherever they could find them.

 

Conventional thinking at the time was that the three NRD schools were a package deal. Ironically enough, Blacksburg and Christiansburg were the SWD expansion targets coveted by Graham and Richlands in particular (over Grundy's objection), while Carroll was the school that the SWD was willing to take in order to get the other two.

 

Interesting. I didn't live here until early 2008 so I am not aware of all of the "politics" involved. I have heard through other outlets that Carroll seems to have issue with "any idea not their own". I am paraphrasing, of course.

[futbolking 766]

I am giving you the respect of reading your posts before commenting. Please show me the same respect.

 

There is no "you guys". I have no association with the school or the county. I just don't see it as a big deal to let them into the MED since most MED schools already play Carroll. Carroll is only hurting itself by limiting competition. The MED has proven over the past few years, it will step up and play anyone, with success.

 

Instead of saying "you guys"... would you rather me refer to you as "the advocate for Carroll County...from somewhere else?"....

[futbolking 766]

it will step up and play anyone, with success.

 

That is all anybody is asking them to do, mr. "advocate for Carroll County".. step up and play schools their own size.

Edited August 29, 2012 by futbolking

[RichlandsAlum 678]

I am a Civil Engineer by trade with several ongoing and previous projects in the areas in question. So it's not a "matter of opinion".

 

 

I am not the one using "differences of opinion" to justify anything, that was RichlandsAlum.

 

 

Don't mean to pick nits, but what the heck.... You really think that Highway 58 and a secondary state road are comparable facilities??

 

And I don't think either sixcat or I were actually justifying anything. I casually noted that this entire highway quality discussion is pretty subjective.

[sixcat 2,937]

Instead of saying "you guys"... would you rather me refer to you as "the advocate for Carroll County...from somewhere else?"....

 

Sure, why not. I just don't want to be lumped into the whole stereotypical, agenda driven, biased facet. ;)

[sixcat 2,937]

That is all anybody is asking them to do, mr. "advocate for Carroll County".. step up and play schools their own size.

 

In "you guys", you do mean the MED given I have mentioned several times on this thread and site that my children attend Galax Schools, right?

 

Carroll has neglected to "step up and play schools their own size" since it opened 45 years ago. This is old hat, even for someone who has only lived in this area for 5 years.

[RichlandsAlum 678]

I agree wholeheartedly but, as I mentioned before, Carroll consolidated in the late 1960's, well before anyone else in this region. These types of issues were not relevant back then.

 

A fair point. At the time of Carroll's consolidation, there was no good reason to imagine a high school sports landscape that didn't include a substantially intact New River District.

[Deleted Account 5,203]

I am a Civil Engineer by trade with several ongoing and previous projects in the areas in question. So it's not a "matter of opinion".

 

Since you want to do a little chest thumping, I'm a lawyer by trade whose primary area of practice at this time includes integrating numerous issues with regards to Virginia Secondary, Virginia Primary, and U.S. Routes on a municipal and county level. This isn't exactly my first trip to the rodeo, either.

 

So, in your "professional opinion", driving over 2/3 of a trip from Hillsville to Rocky Mount over a single U.S. Route is comparable in terms of elevation, road width, and road grade than driving 2/3 of a trip from Richlands to Hurley over multiple Virginia Secondary Routes?

 

Don't be shy. Answer this one for the class.

Edited August 29, 2012 by UVAObserver

[RichlandsAlum 678]

Since you want to do a little chest thumping, I'm a lawyer by trade whose primary area of practice at this time includes integrating numerous issues with regards to Virginia Secondary, Virginia Primary, and U.S. Routes on a municipal and county level.

 

So, in your "professional opinion", driving over 2/3 of a trip from Hillsville to Rocky Mount over a single U.S. Route is comparable in terms of elevation, road width, and road grade than driving 2/3 of a trip from Richlands to Hurley over multiple Virginia Secondary Routes?

 

Don't be shy. Answer this one for the class.

 

(Chiming in).....

 

Since we're all broadcasting our credentials, I've stayed at a Holiday Inn Express on more than three separate occasions.

[Deleted Account 5,203]

I agree wholeheartedly but, as I mentioned before, Carroll consolidated in the late 1960's, well before anyone else in this region. These types of issues were not relevant back then.

 

Without knowing school demographics from distant counties from the 1960s, it would still seem to me that Carroll would be larger than anyone else in the area, given the trend for schools since the '60s has been to contract due to low numbers. In fact, the difference would seem more glaring then than now.

 

Of course, I'm assuming that schools along the I-81 corridor were not 2x their current size.

[Deleted Account 5,203]

(Chiming in).....

 

Since we're all broadcasting our credentials, I've stayed at a Holiday Inn Express on more than three separate occasions.

 

Well played, sir.

[futbolking 766]

In "you guys", you do mean the MED given I have mentioned several times on this thread and site that my children attend Galax Schools, right?

 

Carroll has neglected to "step up and play schools their own size" since it opened 45 years ago. This is old hat, even for someone who has only lived in this area for 5 years.

 

Then why did you say "it will step up and play anyone, with success".... we all know that's not going to happen.

[ghs73 157]

(Chiming in).....

 

Since we're all broadcasting our credentials, I've stayed at a Holiday Inn Express on more than three separate occasions.

 

how about motel 6 does that count for anything seeing as how tom bodet keeps the light on for us all lol.

[sixcat 2,937]

Since you want to do a little chest thumping, I'm a lawyer by trade whose primary area of practice at this time includes integrating numerous issues with regards to Virginia Secondary, Virginia Primary, and U.S. Routes on a municipal and county level.

 

So, in your "professional opinion", driving over 2/3 of a trip from Hillsville to Rocky Mount over a single U.S. Route is comparable in terms of elevation, road width, and road grade than driving 2/3 of a trip from Richlands to Hurley over multiple Virginia Secondary Routes?

 

Don't be shy. Answer this one for the class.

 

I am not chest thumping, just making a point. Anyone who has been on this site for more than 5 minutes knows you are a "lawyer by trade". You take every opportunity to point that out.

 

The argument is not an apples to apples comparison. Driving from Richlands to Hurley is entirely contained inside the Blue Ridge Mountains, which has its own weather systems and conditions resulting from that, as anyone who lives there would know. Driving into southside Virginia is going into entirely different weather patterns. Anyone who has driven from Patrick County into southside with any regularity knows this to be true, for the same reasons Fancy Gap Mountain is famous for unpredictable fog and other weather patterns.

[sixcat 2,937]

Without knowing school demographics from distant counties from the 1960s, it would still seem to me that Carroll would be larger than anyone else in the area, given the trend for schools since the '60s has been to contract due to low numbers. In fact, the difference would seem more glaring then than now.

 

Of course, I'm assuming that schools along the I-81 corridor were not 2x their current size.

 

 

Carroll County would have been considerably smaller between the late 60's and mid 80's because of Galax. I know that don't make a lot of sense but it's true. Before the consolidation of Independence and Fries in 1988, the kids who lived in the communities just outside Galax attended Galax schools. Once Grayson County was created, Galax stopped allowing non city residents to attend it's schools without prior consent. Galax was a AA school until the mid 1980's with an enrollment of 800 or so. The majority of those 500 kids Galax lost went to Carroll.

Edited August 29, 2012 by sixcat

[ISOaPBR 15]

True this.

 

Carroll County pinned itself into a corner with consolidation, not terribly unlike what Lee County did to itself back in the '80s. Carroll doubly hurt itself by joining the Southwest District as opposed to the Blue Ridge. I can only imagine someone from Carroll making the drive to Grundy for a Wednesday night basketball game.

 

Moral of the story: if your county is somewhat by itself, don't consolidate into a school that's 2X larger than anyone around you.

 

Consolidation happened in 1969. Thats gonna take a helluva lot of foresight. There were 9the teams in the New River then. Dont talk like it happened 2 years ago.

[ghs73 157]

Since you want to do a little chest thumping, I'm a lawyer by trade whose primary area of practice at this time includes integrating numerous issues with regards to Virginia Secondary, Virginia Primary, and U.S. Routes on a municipal and county level. This isn't exactly my first trip to the rodeo, either.

 

So, in your "professional opinion", driving over 2/3 of a trip from Hillsville to Rocky Mount over a single U.S. Route is comparable in terms of elevation, road width, and road grade than driving 2/3 of a trip from Richlands to Hurley over multiple Virginia Secondary Routes?

 

Don't be shy. Answer this one for the class.

 

dang UVAO you are a lawyer wow. lol

[Deleted Account 5,203]

I am not chest thumping, just making a point. Anyone who has been on this site for more than 5 minutes knows you are a "lawyer by trade". You take every opportunity to point that out.

 

The argument is not an apples to apples comparison. Driving from Richlands to Hurley is entirely contained inside the Blue Ridge Mountains, which has its own weather systems and conditions resulting from that, as anyone who lives there would know. Driving into southside Virginia is going into entirely different weather patterns. Anyone who has driven from Patrick County into southside with any regularity knows this to be true, for the same reasons Fancy Gap Mountain is famous for unpredictable fog and other weather patterns.

 

I don't believe that I rub that fact in everyone's faces, and I only brought it up to show that I'm not just whistlin' Dixie about the subject at hand. I don't believe that's a fair criticism.

 

As to your second paragraph, I believe you're stretching the argument to an extent in which it doesn't hold any weight. The shift between Hillsville and Rocky Mount, VA is simply from the Blue Ridge to the Piedmont. You speak as if we're going from the Continental Divide to Death Valley, CA; now THAT is "entirely different". It's a shift that Carroll County makes willingly at least three times a year (playing Bassett, Martinsville, Mt. Airy, etc.), and has frequently made elsewhere in other sports.

 

The climates are darned near the same, anyway. Both are considered part of the humid subtropical climate. Both average from 40-60 inches of rain per year. Both have warm, humid summers with cool, precipitous winters. What this boils down to is FOG. You get a tiny bit more fog driving from Hillsville to Rocky Mount than you do from Hillsville to Bluefield. Heck, Carroll County is perfectly pleased with going up Fancy Gap coming back from Mt. Airy, and you even commented yourself on Fancy Gap fog.

 

That's a weak argument.

[Deleted Account 5,203]

Consolidation happened in 1969. Thats gonna take a helluva lot of foresight. There were 9the teams in the New River then. Dont talk like it happened 2 years ago.

 

Keep up with the thread, please.

[sixcat 2,937]

That's a weak argument.

 

Not really given the weather in that area. Your original question/riddle/exercise can't be substantiated given the fact that it is impossible to drive from Hillsville, Virginia to 2/3 of the way to Rocky Mount, Virginia or vice versa on any single highway.

 

This has become something of the proverbial pissing contest. So, I will agree to disagree with you that you or anyone else for that matter, would want your child to make that trip multiple times per year.

[Deleted Account 5,203]

Carroll County would have been considerably smaller between the late 60's and mid 80's because of Galax. I know that don't make a lot of sense but it's true. Before the consolidation of Independence and Fries in 1988, the kids who lived in the communities just outside Galax attended Galax schools. Once Grayson County was created, Galax stopped allowing non city residents to attend it's schools without prior consent. Galax was a AA school until the mid 1980's with an enrollment of 800 or so. The majority of those 500 kids Galax lost went to Carroll.

 

I appreciate the insight. I understand the reasoning that Galax would close its borders to non-city residents, but it seems like the benefit to the schools from state monies would outweigh the considerations against losing ~500 students. I'd like to know more about why Galax would decide as they did.

 

It makes more sense now, and explains why Carroll's stuck between a rock and a hard place with enrollment.

[sixcat 2,937]

I appreciate the insight. I understand the reasoning that Galax would close its borders to non-city residents, but it seems like the benefit to the schools from state monies would outweigh the considerations against losing ~500 students. I'd like to know more about why Galax would decide as they did.

 

It makes more sense now, and explains why Carroll's stuck between a rock and a hard place with enrollment.

 

As I have said before, I don't "know" all of the facts given I did not live here from age 17 until 2008.

 

It is my understanding, Galax was massively overcrowded during that time and took the opportunity to limit it's enrollment so it would not have to renovate or build a new school. The "unofficial-official" cutoff is currently at 35%, meaning, 35% of the current enrollment in Galax Public Schools come from outside the city limits. That number was evidently double back then.

[sixcat 2,937]

As to your second paragraph, I believe you're stretching the argument to an extent in which it doesn't hold any weight. The shift between Hillsville and Rocky Mount, VA is simply from the Blue Ridge to the Piedmont. You speak as if we're going from the Continental Divide to Death Valley, CA; now THAT is "entirely different". It's a shift that Carroll County makes willingly at least three times a year (playing Bassett, Martinsville, Mt. Airy, etc.), and has frequently made elsewhere in other sports.

 

The climates are darned near the same, anyway. Both are considered part of the humid subtropical climate. Both average from 40-60 inches of rain per year. Both have warm, humid summers with cool, precipitous winters. What this boils down to is FOG. You get a tiny bit more fog driving from Hillsville to Rocky Mount than you do from Hillsville to Bluefield. Heck, Carroll County is perfectly pleased with going up Fancy Gap coming back from Mt. Airy, and you even commented yourself on Fancy Gap fog.

 

That's a weak argument.

 

The Crest of the Blue Ridge Mountains in Patrick County and Carroll County, VA, and Alleghany County, NC forms the eastern and southern border of the Eastern Continental Divide and is home to the Blue Ridge Parkway. Average elevation is from 2,500 to 3,000 feet with the highest peaks of 4,000 feet or more in the Peach Bottom Mountains in the mid-section of Alleghany County, NC.

 

That is taken straight from the "continental divide of the Americas" Wikipedia page.

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Continental_Divide_of_the_Americas

 

The Blue Ridge Parkway, which a portion of lies less than 5 miles from my house, is littered with signage discussing the "Great Eastern Continental Divide".

[olewave 44]

Read the newspaper article pasted in this thread. Carroll would not have to play Bland or Narrows, or any other school 2 classes below themselves. The VHSL is already doing this with another district.

 

It's a cumulative issue. Trade a few long trips for ALL long trips.

 

If that is the case, then do not play Franklin County!

[sixcat 2,937]

If that is the case, then do not play Franklin County!

 

The issue is not in playing Franklin County, (granted, I believe it to be an underlying issue of not wanting to step up in competition) it is travel. As mentioned before, this will continue to be a growing issue as more areas consolidate schools.