SWD Predictions

[Gfan 155]

58 minutes ago, UVAObserver said:

Until one of 2-4 can prove differently, I don’t see how this is even an argument.

Next year might be Tazewell’s best shot. Graham will have to replace the QB, their best WR/CB, and 4 out of 5 linemen among others.

[old_school_blue 247]

On 8/19/2022 at 11:01 PM, SwvaOG said:

Richlands’ spread is morphing and I’m curious to see how it looks mid-season.  It will be more evident this year they’ll be a spread to run team as I believe they will run Brown until the wheels fall off. I’m reserving judgement until they return all their OL. Tarter is putting in the work.  That being said, Bulldogs have the better athletes and seem to be putting in the work…at least offensively.  I feel that the Blues place more of an emphasis on defense than the Dawgs and I like Richlands ability to develop and coach up good line play more than Tazewell.   I would not be shocked to see either team win this year and I hope to attend the game.  I’m also curious as to how many on this board have actually suited up and marked their helmet up with some navy blue or Kelly green?

 

Responding to you and Bandana, as far as the Spread in Richlands, that is their comfort zone and probably all some of them know.  It is an ideology in Richlands.  IMO, there is no morphing.  Same ole, same ole.  There is little threat of the pass this year, coaching is not brain surgery.  Graham and Tazewell will lock on receivers and dedicate safeties and linebackers to the run.  This is exactly what happened to Richlands in playoff games when Mance was here.  Sorry, it is true.  Spread teams do not fire off in the same manner as teams that run traditional offenses, again, this greatly reduces their ability to consistently run the football.  If teams are going to lock corners on receivers and nullify them, why have them in the game.  Load up with blocking backs and tight ends, which makes the running game more efficient while working the clock.  I equate the spread to having a performance sports car while living in the mountains, it isn't practical. I am not knocking Tarter or any of the coaches.  I personally believe at the high school level; coaches should be married to the strengths of their kids and not trying to maintain an ideology.  Two examples come to mind, Smith at Appomattox mixing the split back veer with some spread looks.  Also, Simon in Bluefield, I have watched the Beavers run spread, double wing and the I formation, depending on the strength of his roster.

[BandanaVTDavis4321 1,717]

Old school blue. You nailed it imo. I agree with 100 percent of what you wrote. Now, it's one thing if you have WRs that can't be one on oned in open space, but that requires more than Sage Webb (graduated). You need 3 speedy guys, or at least 2 that forces another safety or DB  over the top on both sides of the field, and Richlands doesn't have those guys that can do that for 14 or 15 games anymore, nor does 90+ percent of other Class 1 and 2 teams in the state. Sooner or later, you run into a team that can play one on one forcing you to be capable of running it.

As for what you wrote about 4 spread out. I agree, move them in the box and let them lead block. Only my opinion though. Look back in Class 1 and 2 and check how many state titles have been won by pass first/spread teams. It happens, but it is rare or the  exception to the rule.

[Tru Blue 72 423]

On 8/21/2022 at 7:57 PM, BandanaVTDavis4321 said:

Old school blue. You nailed it imo. I agree with 100 percent of what you wrote. Now, it's one thing if you have WRs that can't be one on oned in open space, but that requires more than Sage Webb (graduated). You need 3 speedy guys, or at least 2 that forces another safety or DB  over the top on both sides of the field, and Richlands doesn't have those guys that can do that for 14 or 15 games anymore, nor does 90+ percent of other Class 1 and 2 teams in the state. Sooner or later, you run into a team that can play one on one forcing you to be capable of running it.

As for what you wrote about 4 spread out. I agree, move them in the box and let them lead block. Only my opinion though. Look back in Class 1 and 2 and check how many state titles have been won by pass first/spread teams. It happens, but it is rare or the  exception to the rule.

Agree totally, even a spread orientated offense has to be able to run the ball in the red zone.  When Mance won the state title, Caleb Jennings was vitally important to the offense and could run through, around or over line backers in the red zone.  The other years in the State finals, the run inside the red zone failed and Richlands lost.  Now I know you can't attribute every loss to a failed run game, but I believe it was a bad missing element in those Mance years.  Run first, pass second, and only when you have to.  In 1992 this was the format for the Richlands program and it worked out, but the talent was also there, and the work ethic also.  Not sure the players or coaches today have that same work ethic.  IMO, unless I'm missing something, and I hate to vocalize it, but Richlands is at best a 2 & 8 team this year.

[SwvaOG 601]

1 hour ago, Tru Blue 72 said:

Agree totally, even a spread orientated offense has to be able to run the ball in the red zone.  When Mance won the state title, Caleb Jennings was vitally important to the offense and could run through, around or over line backers in the red zone.  The other years in the State finals, the run inside the red zone failed and Richlands lost.  Now I know you can't attribute every loss to a failed run game, but I believe it was a bad missing element in those Mance years.  Run first, pass second, and only when you have to.  In 1992 this was the format for the Richlands program and it worked out, but the talent was also there, and the work ethic also.  Not sure the players or coaches today have that same work ethic.  IMO, unless I'm missing something, and I hate to vocalize it, but Richlands is at best a 2 & 8 team this year.

It isn’t hard to shift the pass spread to a spread to run offense.  Oregon did this to great success the last 15 years or so.  Everyone assumes spread is a pass oriented offense, which, it often isn’t.  The concept of spreading the field and getting numbers for the RB and QB is just as dangerous as a power running game.  The caveat is that you have to be creative with your blocking scheme (using a Bash concept, example).  Additionally you absolutely need an athletic QB.  If you don’t have those two things it will be hard to run.  The SEC and some of the other Power 5 have adapted double teams and ISO with spread concepts to make a power spread.  Good spread teams make great use of the versatile H back roll.  The H back roll can be lethal if the kid can also catch the ball.

Perhaps Mance fell in love with the passing aspect too much.  Perhaps the run blocking scheme wasn’t as effective.  Not sure.  But I will say, you absolutely can run it in SWVA if you buy in and have the staff to coach it.  Hell, RichRod designed a lot of it because he had smaller, less athletic kids in his early coaching days.  And I’ll take it further…a simple RPO scheme can make it hell on a defense…especially one only geared to stop the run.  I’d be remiss if I didn’t call out the absolute need of your WRs to hold blocks in space.  A couple of great blocking WRs is deadly in a spread.

[Jags52 346]

You old timers absolutely kill me. The statement that you cant come off the ball in the spread like you do in a 1905 offense is just ignorance on your part. Now I do understand that most of the teams in the lower classifications do not run spread and are plenty successful Riverheads is a prime example of that and to a certain extent you do have to have some speed for it to work. When you run the spread football turns into a numbers game. It gives you options. If you are less talented than another team it gives you a fighting chance. If you put 11 guys near that ball the defense will do the same and that turns into are my 11 better than your 11. If your 11 are better than go for it. 

Now with that being said you have to be a damn good coach and know the ends and outs of your offense in order to take advantage of said number. If you throw 4 receivers out there for the hell of it with no scheme then you are dead in the water. @SwvaOG brings up a great point your best athlete has to be a Q if he cant hurt teams with his legs you are in trouble. 

Me and @redtiger have had good conversations about this before and I love talking ball and will do it all day. Personally I dont like the 3 yards and a cloud of dust mentally its boring to me and easy to prepare for. You want the opposing DC to not be able to sleep at night because your OC can take advantage of numbers. Richlands issue is not the spread. Sometimes you just dont have the kids or your not putting them in the best numbers advantage possible   

[BandanaVTDavis4321 1,717]

SwvaOG, the example you gave on having a spread offensive formation, yet not necessarily being pass first was a thing done well by Rich Rod when he was at WVU.  They often had 3 and 4 split wide and was a heavy rush oriented first team.

[Jags52 346]

12 minutes ago, BandanaVTDavis4321 said:

SwvaOG, the example you gave on having a spread offensive formation, yet not necessarily being pass first was a thing done well by Rich Rod when he was at WVU.  They often had 3 and 4 split wide and was a heavy rush oriented first team.

Yes that is the best way to go when your Q can run the ball. It gives you an extra blocker and the ability to zone read someone to death.

[SwvaOG 601]

3 hours ago, Jags52 said:

Yes that is the best way to go when your Q can run the ball. It gives you an extra blocker and the ability to zone read someone to death.

And that is a core principle/ concept of spread…..we are +1 no matter the look or option and the QB is a threat that has to be accountable for.