Graham to Mountain Empire?

[futbolking 766]

That's not a safe assumption. There's a long explanation for that, but I'll try to condense it.

 

Grundy is actually the key to the perceived "unity" of the core membership of the SWD. Graham broached exactly the same notion of dropping to the MED about 20 years ago. The administration of the TCPS at that time vetoed that notion and established an unofficial policy which said that GHS, RHS, and THS would remain in the SWD along with Grundy until such time as Grundy's position changed. Therefore, Grundy's decision to move to the BDD effectively cancelled that "policy."

 

Graham's unilateral action to join the MED also effectively destroys the myth of "unity" among Tazewell County schools. It's now every school for themselves. Tazewell and Richlands may continue to schedule the G-Men, but only if they determine that this would be profitable on a cost/benefit basis. (As an example, I would identify the on-again, off-again status of the "series" between Richlands and Bluefield.)

 

I have great sentimental attachment to the SWD and its history, but this is purely a business decision. And I think that Graham's move to Group A (and the MED in particular) makes a lot of sense.

 

However, from the standpoint of scheduling non-district games, all bets are off.

 

Come on........there's 0% chance these 3 don't play each other.

[futbolking 766]

I wouldn't mind seeing Graham get some new "blood" on their schedule anyway...lots of good old rivalries could be renewed and some new rivalries may be born. If Richlands and Tazewell don't/won't play Graham as a non-district game...fine with me...they can take their ball and go home...:rolleyes:

 

Exactly....pick up Giles, Radford, Floyd....all of these teams travel with a lot of folks and would be a good gate...

 

I think Giles sends the whole county to every away game....sent 3,000 ro a regular season game in floyd a few years back...

[hoard 18]

I guess it was due to Giles being Group A, but I always wondered why Graham didn't play them in football. Giles used to play Tazewell and Graham regularly in the late 80s and even played Richlands twice.

 

Giles seems to have trouble getting football games, so you would think a series with Graham would be no-brainer.

[dawgs86 10]

Giles usually does pretty well with non-district games.. They won't drop christiansburg, blacksburg, or george wythe for graham but they would probably drop haysi..

[hoard 18]

Giles usually does pretty well with non-district games.. They won't drop christiansburg, blacksburg, or george wythe for graham but they would probably drop haysi..

 

I think they started playing GW just recently. I know in the recent past they've played (in addition to Haysi) William Fleming, some NC school, and maybe Covington (not sure on that one). It just seems that they have a long-distance opponent at least once a year and Graham would be a logical, more local choice.

[trigger 10]

Exactly....pick up Giles, Radford, Floyd....all of these teams travel with a lot of folks and would be a good gate...

 

I think Giles sends the whole county to every away game....sent 3,000 ro a regular season game in floyd a few years back...

 

I figure Graham to be at least an hour and 1/2 from Floyd. I don't see a regular season meeting between those 2. I think GW is more realistic than any TRD teams. Giles could drop Haysi and take on Graham.

 

Graham should have no trouble with scheduling. They are picking up a completely new district. I am sure that 5 of the current 10 teams will keep them om the schedule.

[futbolking 766]

I figure Graham to be at least an hour and 1/2 from Floyd. I don't see a regular season meeting between those 2. I think GW is more realistic than any TRD teams. Giles could drop Haysi and take on Graham.

 

Graham should have no trouble with scheduling. They are picking up a completely new district. I am sure that 5 of the current 10 teams will keep them om the schedule.

 

You're right...about an hour and a half to Bluefield from Floyd...Giles is about same distance from Bluefield as Wytheville...if you travel down 460...so one of those 2 would be a nice pickup for Graham...

 

Graham had played Radford in past years during the regular season, but that was 20 years ago.

[redtiger 1,742]

I have no inside info whatsoever but I think the Haysi Giles series was made simply because the 2 teams needed a 10th game, I dont see it going past next season

 

an important note is that with declining enrollment far SWVA is not the only area being adversly affected, with the SWD schools droping and tazewell and richlands on the horizion region 4 as a whole will be adversly affected. Once the Roanake area schools begin to feel the affects of these changes maybe the VH$L will be more likley to listen to an expanded A classification setup

 

Richlands as well as Tazewell to the BDD isw a bad idea, as far as Haysi is concerned those schools are no more formidable than Giles, Gate City or Powell Valley, teams we have played in the playoffs for years. Honaker already plays tazewell and richlands (all be it without much success) but the problem is hurley and twin valley espicially in football but in other sports too. And how is it fair for a school like council with an enrollment under 150 to play richlands or tazewell with enrollments over 700 in anything, espicially as a district opponent.

 

I think that grundy will fit nicely but when Richlands and Tazewell drop (and they will) region D should forget about tradition and start from scratch with 4 new districts

LPD SWD CD BDD with, in some cases drastically different makeups 2 districts for D2 2 for D1. As someone else stated work with Region C and divide things based on travel.

[trigger 10]

Eastern Montgomery is he lone D1 school in the Three Rivers District and nothing has been done about it. They have never won the district in football and have only beaten Floyd, Radford, and Giles once over many years. James RIver is the only D2 school in the Pioneer. THey haven't changed anything regarding these 2 schools to even things out so I wouldn't expect anything to happen anywhere else unless it's based on travel. In our economy, traveling and expenses will win out.

[GMan 3,569]

I'll post this again since it may have been overlooked earlier...

 

Here's what I see in the next 5-10 years...especially if Wise Co. goes through with consolidation and all the SWD schools end up in Class A

 

Region D-

BDD: Grundy, Haysi, Honaker, Hurley, Twin Valley, Council

CMD: Tazewell, Richlands, Lebanon, John Battle, Virginia, Abingdon

LPD: Gate City, Lee, Clintwood, Appy/PV, Pound/Kelly, St. Paul/Coeburn

CD: J.I. Burton, Castlewood, Ervinton, Rye Cove, Twin Springs, Thomas Walker

 

Region C-

Hogo: Marion, Chilhowie, Patrick Henry, Holston, Northwood, Rural Retreat

MED: Graham, Bland Co., Fort Chiswell, George Wythe, Galax, Grayson Co.

TRD: Auburn, East. Mont., Floyd Co., Giles, Radford, Narrows

Pioneer: Glenvar, Bath Co., Covington, Craig Co., James River, Parry McCluer, Highland

[trigger 10]

Could be close but not sure why GW and Narrows would swap districts. It would be closer traveling for Narrows. I doubt Narrows wants in the TRD. Don't see that one happening.

[hoard 18]

I'm not sure that Glenvar would want back in the Pioneer, because they left it to join the Three Rivers several years ago. I remember a Glenvar alum telling me once how much they hated going to Highland and Bath Co. for games because of the distance.

 

I could see one or both regions going to districts based on enrollment--basically two Division 1 and two Division 2 districts. The smaller schools will definitely push for it if former AA schools drop down and start dominating multiple sports. It works out great for football and basketball, but not as much for other sports without divisional play if the smaller schools aren't competitive.

[trigger 10]

I'm not sure that Glenvar would want back in the Pioneer, because they left it to join the Three Rivers several years ago. I remember a Glenvar alum telling me once how much they hated going to Highland and Bath Co. for games because of the distance.

 

I could see one or both regions going to districts based on enrollment--basically two Division 1 and two Division 2 districts. The smaller schools will definitely push for it if former AA schools drop down and start dominating multiple sports. It works out great for football and basketball, but not as much for other sports without divisional play if the smaller schools aren't competitive.

 

This would be nice and would definitely even the playing field but traveling again would be an issue. East Mont in the Pioneer would put them driving to Bath and Highland and that's 20 minutes more than Glenvar was driving. It makes since from a competitve stand point to swap East Mont and James River but it would be alot of traveling. Giles/Floyd to James River is a decent haul. Playing once in football is one thing but traveling for every single sport is another.

[swvacsas2 15]

I'll post this again since it may have been overlooked earlier...

 

Region D-

BDD: Grundy, Haysi, Honaker, Hurley, Twin Valley, Council

CMD: Tazewell, Richlands, Lebanon, John Battle, Virginia, Abingdon

LPD: Gate City, Lee, Clintwood, Appy/PV, Pound/Kelly, St. Paul/Coeburn

CD: J.I. Burton, Castlewood, Ervinton, Rye Cove, Twin Springs, Thomas Walker

 

As a Wise County resident I think this is a good idea. Would hate to think the SWD and LPD would just go up in smoke. The recent Wise County schools consolidation has altered considerably in the last three months. It does not appear that the money is around for three schools. The school board is looking at a two school scenario- doing away with Coeburn. I attended a meeting at St. Paul last Thursday and it was obvious that very few if any SPHS students would go to Coeburn or to a school at Wise. Appalachia will probably send 75%- 90% of its kids to Burton- though some have mentioned Rye Cove and even Gate City as possibilities. Pound will probably go about 60% to Clintwood- some going to Burton and Jenkins, Ky.- a couple even to Ervinton and Haysi- with the remainder to Wise. Coeburn would probably split as well losing students to Ervinton, Burton, and Castlewood, possibly Twin Springs. I feel Burton would stay in the LPD with a big boost in enrollment. Dickenson County is also looking at consolidation- depending on finances. I might add that there is some consideration of one high school in Wise County based on the school within a school concept (two,three, or four schools on the same campus sharing some facilities).

[hoard 18]

Region D-

BDD: Grundy, Haysi, Honaker, Hurley, Twin Valley, Council

CMD: Tazewell, Richlands, Lebanon, John Battle, Virginia, Abingdon

LPD: Gate City, Lee, Clintwood, Appy/PV, Pound/Kelly, St. Paul/Coeburn

CD: J.I. Burton, Castlewood, Ervinton, Rye Cove, Twin Springs, Thomas Walker

 

As a Wise County resident I think this is a good idea. Would hate to think the SWD and LPD would just go up in smoke. The recent Wise County schools consolidation has altered considerably in the last three months. It does not appear that the money is around for three schools. The school board is looking at a two school scenario- doing away with Coeburn. I attended a meeting at St. Paul last Thursday and it was obvious that very few if any SPHS students would go to Coeburn or to a school at Wise. Appalachia will probably send 75%- 90% of its kids to Burton- though some have mentioned Rye Cove and even Gate City as possibilities. Pound will probably go about 60% to Clintwood- some going to Burton and Jenkins, Ky.- a couple even to Ervinton and Haysi- with the remainder to Wise. Coeburn would probably split as well losing students to Ervinton, Burton, and Castlewood, possibly Twin Springs. I feel Burton would stay in the LPD with a big boost in enrollment. Dickenson County is also looking at consolidation- depending on finances. I might add that there is some consideration of one high school in Wise County based on the school within a school concept (two,three, or four schools on the same campus sharing some facilities).

 

Just curious, but why would 75% or more of Appalachia kids go to Burton? I know SOME of them probably live closer to Norton but that many?

 

Or is it just some Appy residents P***** off that they're losing their school and refusing to send their kids to a Wise County school?

[swvacsas2 15]

Just curious, but why would 75% or more of Appalachia kids go to Burton? I know SOME of them probably live closer to Norton but that many?

 

Or is it just some Appy residents P***** off that they're losing their school and refusing to send their kids to a Wise County school?

 

Combination of both. There is so much anger in Appalachia that there is going to be a major effort to keep kids out of a Big Stone or Wise school. Several people in Appalachia have been working on transportation issues to get the kids to other schools. Burton can hold several more kids- but I am not certain that it can take all who will want to go there. Wise County is already in talks with Russell to take the St. Paul kids- doubt they will do the same with Norton.

[RichlandsAlum 678]

I'll post this again since it may have been overlooked earlier...I'll post this again since it may have been overlooked earlier...

 

 

Quote:

Here's what I see in the next 5-10 years...especially if Wise Co. goes through with consolidation and all the SWD schools end up in Class A

 

Region D-

BDD: Grundy, Haysi, Honaker, Hurley, Twin Valley, Council

CMD: Tazewell, Richlands, Lebanon, John Battle, Virginia, Abingdon

LPD: Gate City, Lee, Clintwood, Appy/PV, Pound/Kelly, St. Paul/Coeburn

CD: J.I. Burton, Castlewood, Ervinton, Rye Cove, Twin Springs, Thomas Walker

 

Region C-

Hogo: Marion, Chilhowie, Patrick Henry, Holston, Northwood, Rural Retreat

MED: Graham, Bland Co., Fort Chiswell, George Wythe, Galax, Grayson Co.

TRD: Auburn, East. Mont., Floyd Co., Giles, Radford, Narrows

Pioneer: Glenvar, Bath Co., Covington, Craig Co., James River, Parry McCluer, Highland

 

__________________

 

I like this proposal, but it will require a lot of coordination among the individual schools involved. And as much as I'd like to see this kind of ideal arrangement come to fruition, I'm cynical enough to think that the most likely outcome will be the path of least resistance. And IMO, the path of least resistance will see individual SWD schools plug into existing districts as they drop to Group A.

 

I don't think Richlands to the BDD is anybody's idea of an ideal arrangement. But given the ham-fisted way that the VHSL addresses realignment issues, I think it's the kind of outcome for which folks should be prepared. Nobody will be happier than me if I'm wrong.

[trublue 939]

Well, sir.....I hope this is one of those times you are wrong in where "the tornado" will eventually set down....:D

 

However, here is another turn of the "spinning wheel" where it stops who knows.

The 3 high schools: Haysi, Clintwood and Ervinton

 

excerpt:

"With an infusion of $19.5 million in federal funds, Dickenson County may be able to consolidate its three aging high schools into one state-of-the art facility."

 

http://www2.tricities.com/tri/news/local/education/article/dickenson_county_schools_to_receive_19.5_million/40664/

[hoard 18]

If Wise County ends up going with just two schools, that creates more issues. Even if Russell Co. takes all of the St. Paul kids, that still leaves close to 1900 kids to be divvied up--meaning two new AA schools with no district to play in. They'll be in the same predicament as what Abingdon eventually faces if Richlands, Tazewell and Marion drop.

 

If you add up the current enrollments of the three Dickenson County schools they would barely be AA, but they'll likely be low enough to fall under the Group A cutoff by the time consolidation occurs.

[Beamerball 566]

Combination of both. There is so much anger in Appalachia that there is going to be a major effort to keep kids out of a Big Stone or Wise school. Several people in Appalachia have been working on transportation issues to get the kids to other schools. Burton can hold several more kids- but I am not certain that it can take all who will want to go there. Wise County is already in talks with Russell to take the St. Paul kids- doubt they will do the same with Norton.

 

Got plenty who could probably easily go to Lee (esp. that live in Keokee) but that would mean sending them to that so called "bad", "consolidated school", so that won't happen either. Would make for even more interesting situation if Burton joined the consolidation plans. Guess it would be off to Jenkins (or Rye Cove, forget about them as being as a said option) then.

Edited February 2, 2010 by Beamerball

[swvacsas2 15]

If Wise County ends up going with just two schools, that creates more issues. Even if Russell Co. takes all of the St. Paul kids, that still leaves close to 1900 kids to be divvied up--meaning two new AA schools with no district to play in. They'll be in the same predicament as what Abingdon eventually faces if Richlands, Tazewell and Marion drop.

 

If you add up the current enrollments of the three Dickenson County schools they would barely be AA, but they'll likely be low enough to fall under the Group A cutoff by the time consolidation occurs.

 

Wise County would go with the school within a school concept- two or more schools would be located on the same campus and would share all the big ticket facilities- athletic,library, and etc.- they would technically be separate high schools. They seem to feel the VHSL will buy the concept. The Superintendent has stated that a Wise school (in the two separate schools scenario) would be given a Lee style hardship waiver to play down. Would be very surprised if this happened. In that scenario the Big Stone school would have single A numbers. It does not appear at this time that Norton is coming in with Wise County. If Norton does- I feel a lot of Appalachia kids will head to Rye Cove. Many Pound kids will want to go to Dickenson County regardless of their consolidation plans. Did not think Haysi high etc. has ever been flooded.

[trigger 10]

THat is a crazy idea. That would end up like "Friday Night Lights" scenario. Dillon trying to steal the east Dillon players. Maybe a better example is an elementary school that has more than 1 team. They always seem to stack 1 of them.

 

No way that works. Teams would be fighting each other. How would 2 sets of teams use the practice facilities? 2 jv girls basketball teams. 2 jv boys basketball teams etc. No way.

[hoard 18]

THat is a crazy idea. That would end up like "Friday Night Lights" scenario. Dillon trying to steal the east Dillon players. Maybe a better example is an elementary school that has more than 1 team. They always seem to stack 1 of them.

 

No way that works. Teams would be fighting each other. How would 2 sets of teams use the practice facilities? 2 jv girls basketball teams. 2 jv boys basketball teams etc. No way.

 

That's what I was thinking---what's to prevent kids from "transferring" to the other school just for sports?

 

In addition, are they going to pay two separate school administrations (two principals, two vice-principals, etc)? And why pay the money to support two athletic programs when everyone is at the same location?

 

Maybe there's something I've missed here, but this idea seems unnecessary, like it's only being done to placate some opponents of the consolidation.

[RichlandsAlum 678]

Consolidation is a variable that could possibly skew the equation, but only in the short term.

 

For one thing, it takes about eighteen months (and that's typically a "best case" scenario) to construct a new school facility. And that's from the point at which most of the engineering and design work is completed. By the time the politicians in Wise and Dickenson get around to actually doing something, the new consolidated schools might be under the Group A threshold anyway.

 

On average, the entire area south and west of interstates 77 and 81 is losing population. It's just a matter of time until all schools within this specific area hit Group A numbers. An expedited consolidation might keep the SWD afloat for a short while as a Group AA league, but the writing is pretty clearly on the wall.

 

If school boards and supervisors could get their act together and focus on adjustments to existing attendance lines for existing schools, this is one situation that could be resolved and stabilized. And potentially for a very long time.

[swvacsas2 15]

That's what I was thinking---what's to prevent kids from "transferring" to the other school just for sports?

 

In addition, are they going to pay two separate school administrations (two principals, two vice-principals, etc)? And why pay the money to support two athletic programs when everyone is at the same location?

 

Maybe there's something I've missed here, but this idea seems unnecessary, like it's only being done to placate some opponents of the consolidation.

 

All of the consolidation opponents I know will not support one or two schools. The consideration is strictly financial. This concept is being used more in urban areas than rural ones. Wise County is having problems putting the money together. If you have the same food preparation area, medical staff, library staff, etc. you can save money. Administrative staff would not be significantly increased by the proposal. In a two school scenario only one additional principal would be needed- in a three or four the assistant principals would be eliminated. In order to transfer between the school for sports a waiver by the superintendent would be needed- otherwise they would have to set out a year. This problem is bedeviling the St. Paul swap with Russell. I am told that VHSL rules changed about 15 years ago in cases of consolidation or closing bring those instances under the general eligibility rules. VHSL will probably end up with some lawsuits.