Ryan4VT 4,554 Report Share Posted November 3, 2016 What Beamerball said. If you're looking to jump someone and you see the averages and you are .33333334 behind them, you have NO idea what it will take to jump them. If you look at those same teams and see there's an 8 point gap, you know immediately what it will take. I like the numbers better. It make sure it far easier to know exactly what you need at the end of the day. futbolking and BlueRazor 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VHSLhelper 571 Report Share Posted November 3, 2016 you know, I could waste half an hour and go through and put decimals everywhere, so "2 for each" becomes ".2 for each" and "235" becomes "23.5". Think that would make it easier to understand? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VHSLhelper 571 Report Share Posted November 3, 2016 I understand that some ppl. just don't get it. Had a sportswriter tell me that my ratings were misleading. I asked why. He said "because you have Grundy ranked so high". Some ppl. just "zone" on the whole average thing - it's like they can't see the forest for the trees. I just keep saying "it doesn't matter what the avg. is today, what matters is where you are after the last game", and my stuff gets you there faster. I've been doing this for nearly 30 years, and have yet see anyone else even try something like it. Shoot, haven't even seen someone try my method in other Regions. cityofRaven, BlueRazor and Ryan4VT 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leatherhead Larry 530 Report Share Posted November 3, 2016 Just ignore the haters and keep up the good work Helper. Chappy 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VHSLhelper 571 Report Share Posted November 3, 2016 Thought I'd try something to see how it would look.... Graham and Glenvar both play a 6-win 2A (or effective 2A) school - Floyd and Narrows, and will get 30 points for a win, 13 for a loss. Graham now = 26.56, W/L : +.34 / -1.36 Glenvar now = 22.00, W/L : +.8 / -.9 That's better, makes more sense, right? Anyone who wants the decimals in, you've only got 48 more school to go... knock yourselves out. mv91 and futbolking 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1inStripes 932 Report Share Posted November 3, 2016 Whether you divide by 10 or give the total, the order is still the same. It's a breakdown of numbers giving you a better idea of what the team needs, which you don't see giving the avg. rating. If you need the rating for whatever reason...divide. You get the same end results at the end of the season no matter how you list it. Most times than not its the same, but not always. Lets say Rye Cove had been in playoff contention this year. Total points would have looked a lot lower than most because they only factor in 9 games instead. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deleted Account 5,203 Report Share Posted November 3, 2016 Most times than not its the same, but not always. Lets say Rye Cove had been in playoff contention this year. Total points would have looked a lot lower than most because they only factor in 9 games instead. Precisely. Not all schedules are made equal. I would rather use a metric that is correct 100% of the time than use one that is correct 95% of the time, but unwieldy and misleading, because it's slightly easier to compute. 1inStripes 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ryan4VT 4,554 Report Share Posted November 3, 2016 Thought I'd try something to see how it would look.... Graham and Glenvar both play a 6-win 2A (or effective 2A) school - Floyd and Narrows, and will get 30 points for a win, 13 for a loss. Graham now = 26.56, W/L : +.34 / -1.36 Glenvar now = 22.00, W/L : +.8 / -.9 That's better, makes more sense, right? Anyone who wants the decimals in, you've only got 48 more school to go... knock yourselves out. That makes it WAYYYYYY more confusing to look at. Chappy 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deleted Account 5,203 Report Share Posted November 3, 2016 That makes it WAYYYYYY more confusing to look at. It's also a gross misrepresentation of what I said. 1inStripes, mv91 and GMan 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deleted Account 5,203 Report Share Posted November 3, 2016 And I'm fully aware that my position on this is likely the minority position, and that's OK. But the overall points calculation does not measure what it intends to measure, and that's the litmus test for a faulty statistic. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ryan4VT 4,554 Report Share Posted November 3, 2016 And I'm fully aware that my position on this is likely the minority position, and that's OK. But the overall points calculation does not measure what it intends to measure, and that's the litmus test for a faulty statistic. It measures the points that you have at that week. We all know Richlands is done. They have more points than anyone right now, but we know that won't be the same because they're off this week. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mv91 259 Report Share Posted November 3, 2016 I myself like the avg and current seeding like the VHSL shows. But I also like the cheat sheet that gives maximum and minimum points possible and potential seed ranges. Either way, I am ready for the final standings and see where everyone is going. Going to be a fun playoffs Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
swva_havok_fan 1,261 Report Share Posted November 3, 2016 And I'm fully aware that my position on this is likely the minority position, and that's OK. But the overall points calculation does not measure what it intends to measure, and that's the litmus test for a faulty statistic. I stand with you on this subject. The average is the final number that counts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
V-Cats 472 Report Share Posted November 3, 2016 Anyone know if Abingdon is guaranteed a top 4 seed if they beat Marion? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deleted Account 5,203 Report Share Posted November 3, 2016 It measures the points that you have at that week. We all know Richlands is done. They have more points than anyone right now, but we know that won't be the same because they're off this week. Then it is misleading and a factual falsehood to have Richlands listed #1, isn't it? I know I'm being pedantic about something really trivial. mv91 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Falcon Mania 235 Report Share Posted November 3, 2016 Anyone know if Abingdon is guaranteed a top 4 seed if they beat Marion? I'm guessing AHS would be at minimum, if they win against Marion, a top 3 seed. I heard there is a possibility that they could move up. Again, I'm no stats or ranking guru. Maybe ask Union_Fan or VHSL Helper. They seem to have this numbers game down to an art form. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mv91 259 Report Share Posted November 3, 2016 Geesh!!! I had to look up "Pedantic". My IQ level had to increase by 10-15 points!! Thank you UVAObserver :) lol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
swva_havok_fan 1,261 Report Share Posted November 3, 2016 I'm guessing AHS would be at minimum, if they win against Marion, a top 3 seed. I heard there is a possibility that they could move up. Again, I'm no stats or ranking guru. Maybe ask Union_Fan or VHSL Helper. They seem to have this numbers game down to an art form. From a quick glance at my spreadsheet, I think if Abingdon wins, they stay where they are, possibly move to second. Brookville plays 2-7 Jefferson Forest, so that could drop them from #1 to 2 or 3 if Rustburg and Abingdon both win. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beamerball 566 Report Share Posted November 3, 2016 Most times than not its the same, but not always. Lets say Rye Cove had been in playoff contention this year. Total points would have looked a lot lower than most because they only factor in 9 games instead. All you need is a little multiplication, problem solved. Ryan4VT 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VHSLhelper 571 Report Share Posted November 3, 2016 Most times than not its the same, but not always. Lets say Rye Cove had been in playoff contention this year. Total points would have looked a lot lower than most because they only factor in 9 games instead. Nope... must not have looked at them Rye Cove 32 38 # 77.77 # Rye Cove plays ONE "non-public" school, so their total is multiplied by 1.11 to put them on an even keel. I've been doing that for years Beamerball and Ryan4VT 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ryan4VT 4,554 Report Share Posted November 3, 2016 Nope... must not have looked at them Rye Cove 32 38 # 77.77 # Rye Cove plays ONE "non-public" school, so their total is multiplied by 1.11 to put them on an even keel. I've been doing that for years This is what makes the other argument invalid. 9 game teams are already factored into the points. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VHSLhelper 571 Report Share Posted November 3, 2016 Precisely. Not all schedules are made equal. I would rather use a metric that is correct 100% of the time than use one that is correct 95% of the time, but unwieldy and misleading, because it's slightly easier to compute. SLIGHTLY easier? LOL Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VHSLhelper 571 Report Share Posted November 3, 2016 Anyone know if Abingdon is guaranteed a top 4 seed if they beat Marion? Yes, and pretty much a top 3 If Ab. gets 1 for Graham/Narrows, the BEST SR can do is tie, and that's with a Liberty upset over Heritage Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VHSLhelper 571 Report Share Posted November 3, 2016 Nope... must not have looked at them Rye Cove 32 38 # 77.77 # Rye Cove plays ONE "non-public" school, so their total is multiplied by 1.11 to put them on an even keel. I've been doing that for years See Hurley & Tunstall in 2012 http://www.angelfire.com/va/vhsl/2012ratings.html Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VHSLhelper 571 Report Share Posted November 3, 2016 . But the overall points calculation does not measure what it intends to measure, How so? Except for 1 year when I mis-added, 1 year when forfeits came into play, and 1 year when a score was reported backwards by the AP, I've had the same positioning and seedings as was officially announced. Last year I beat the VHSL by 37 hours, and should do the same again this year. NOTE TO ALL - There is a game set for Saturday in Richmond which may mean the official pairings won't be released until mid-day SUNDAY. Ryan4VT 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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